14年秋季GRE提纲互改小组-issue4
本帖来自"15年秋季GRE提纲+全文互改小组"，欢迎关注！你还可以查看更多小组、创建小组4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.
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请回帖时按照指引链接列出英语提纲并用汉语解释并根据指引点评楼上的提纲。 第一个回帖的同学不必点评。
指引链接：https://bbs.gter.net/thread-1777364-1-1.html 4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.
不知道举的例子会不会太“中国特色”了一点>_<
With the prevailing trend of mass media, a great number of scandals are revealed by social media, such as twitter, or weibo in China. Some people argue that scandals are useful since it draws public attention to problems that speakers or reformers may neglect. If we define ‘useful’ as promoting social progress, however, revealing scandals alone is not sufficient, considering people’s capricious interests. Actions of government, the press, as well as the public are needed to tackle the problem that scandals disclosed.
Admittedly, scandals can help us notice some aspects that are previously neglected. “表哥”杨达才的例子。网友在一张新闻照片上发现他戴的名表，随后不断有网友披露新的照片，指出他戴的表和腰带都是名牌，超过公务员的经济承受能力，进而引起相关部门注意，调查杨的腐败问题。如果不是照片被披露，人们不会注意到杨的贪污腐败。
However, revealing scandals alone is not sufficient to promote social progress, since everyday has new news that distracts people’s attention. 在杨达才事件之前，也有其他腐败的丑闻被披露。但经过几天的热烈讨论后，随着新的新闻热点出现，公众的注意力就被转移了，腐败丑闻最终不了了之。仅依靠披露丑闻，并不能阻止丑闻反映的问题再次发生，更不能推动社会的进步。
People who against me may take the famous Watergate Scandal as an example, which directly led to Congress passing legislation making changes in rules for campaign financing, and to Congress’ amending the Freedom of Information Act. 同意水门事件确实是推进社会改革的一个例证，但不能忽视该事件中媒体和司法所起的作用。如果没有记者的不懈挖掘，该事件最终不会被完全披露；如果没有法官对公正的坚持，尼克松也不会被迫上交窃听的录音带。同样，杨达才的例子与之前腐败丑闻的不同在于社会公众与媒体的不断追问，以及最后司法部门的介入。除了揭露丑闻外，推动社会改革需要多方力量的合作。
smily_ray 发表于 2014-10-21 22:45 static/image/common/back.gif
4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or refor ...
4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.
不知道举的例子会不会太“中国特色”了一点>_<
With the prevailing trend of mass media, a great number of scandals are revealed by social media, such as twitter, or weibo in China. Some people argue that scandals are useful since it draws public attention to problems that speakers or reformers may neglect. If we define ‘useful’ as promoting social progress, however, revealing scandals alone is not sufficient, considering people’s capricious interests. Actions of government, the press, as well as the public are needed to tackle the problem that scandals disclosed.
我觉得你举的例子挺好，虽然是中国本土的例子，但只要讲清楚，也是可以的。但是，从例子中如何提炼有深度和适合题目的观点，还需要更多的练习。 你的主旨句中用了however这个词似乎想说我们对useful的定义不同，这个命题就可能是对或者错。我觉得这样写会让你的观点出现内在的矛盾。而在最后一点上，你提出需要其他的因素才能处理好问题，其实这个已经脱离了题目的重大，即丑闻有没有用。
其实你的例子挺好，分析的也不错，或许可以重新组织一下思路
I do not believe that scandals are useful for bringing long-term positive changes to our society. It is true that scandals can bring intense public attention to certain social issues but such attention is at the same time short-lived. Since the government or the other parties involved are usually very skilful in dealing with the public relation crisis, it is very unlikely that the scandals will have any lasting effects on the relevant institutions or policies. Meanwhile, extensive media coverage of all sorts of scandals may alienate the public who become increasingly cynical and pessimistic about the social affairs.
三个分论点
丑闻可以引起公众强烈关注，但是这种关注往往是短暂的，而且关注点往往不对，比如关注桃色新闻等等（这个主旨里没提，可以调整）。
政府和相关机构往往具有强大的公关团队迅速平息事件，转移公众注意力，回避长远的解决问题。
不断的报道各种丑闻，让公众变得悲观而犬儒，不利于积极参与公共事务。
Admittedly, scandals can help us notice some aspects that are previously neglected. “表哥”杨达才的例子。网友在一张新闻照片上发现他戴的名表，随后不断有网友披露新的照片，指出他戴的表和腰带都是名牌，超过公务员的经济承受能力，进而引起相关部门注意，调查杨的腐败问题。如果不是照片被披露，人们不会注意到杨的贪污腐败。
However, revealing scandals alone is not sufficient to promote social progress, since everyday has new news that distracts people’s attention. 在杨达才事件之前，也有其他腐败的丑闻被披露。但经过几天的热烈讨论后，随着新的新闻热点出现，公众的注意力就被转移了，腐败丑闻最终不了了之。仅依靠披露丑闻，并不能阻止丑闻反映的问题再次发生，更不能推动社会的进步。
People who against me may take the famous Watergate Scandal as an example, which directly led to Congress passing legislation making changes in rules for campaign financing, and to Congress’ amending the Freedom of Information Act. 同意水门事件确实是推进社会改革的一个例证，但不能忽视该事件中媒体和司法所起的作用。如果没有记者的不懈挖掘，该事件最终不会被完全披露；如果没有法官对公正的坚持，尼克松也不会被迫上交窃听的录音带。同样，杨达才的例子与之前腐败丑闻的不同在于社会公众与媒体的不断追问，以及最后司法部门的介入。除了揭露丑闻外，推动社会改革需要多方力量的合作。
tesolchina 发表于 2014-10-21 23:30 static/image/common/back.gif
4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or ...
谢谢老师点评~
先问两个问题：
1. 主旨句中的however并不是想说对useful的定义不同，命题的对错就不同。只是想下个定义，然后在这个定义下讨论。从中文看，“然而，如果我们把useful定义成blablabla”好像挺顺，但是用however是转折的意思太强了嘛？
2. 现在回想，我当时分析题目时是把这道题当成另一类claim-reason来写了，题目相当于
Claim: Scandals are useful.
Reason: Scandals focus our attention on problems in ways no speaker or reformer ever could.
只是同时需要回应可能的challenge。
然后我的观点是，如果把useful定义为推动社会进步，同意reason不同意claim。（丑闻能发现问题，但不能推动社会进步（useful），最后提出能让丑闻useful的另一个原因。）第三点如果改成这样的表述会切题些吗：To make scandals useful, actions of government, the press, as well as the public are needed to tackle the problem disclosed.
总想把题目的观点再往深了说一下，但好像一说就偏题了，这个度总把握不好。
晚上再组织下思路重新写个提纲。 I agree that scandals ensure our society to pay attention to problems that used to be hidden from supervision community and public opinion. However, the statement goes too far by failing to consider the possibility that we could overemphasize minor or fake scandals . If followed by that letter, We would probably ignore the merits besides the scandals and would even distort the facts.
1, Some social issues ought to be exposed to the public are concealed from our attention intentionally or unintentionally. 比如SARS刚刚登陆北京的时候，minister of civil health 隐瞒了实情，错失最佳防治机会。这个丑闻曝光后，人们意识到我们的emergency system of diseases 很weak and flawed。Scandals 促进社会关注及改善这样的问题。
2， In the era of mass media boom, scandals are easily wide spread and exaggerated by people who believe in them without hesitation and doubt. 比方说很多群众过分关注公众人物的丑闻而忽略他们的成就。当Bill Clinton 的 sexual scandal 被曝光的时候，他的prestige降到了最低。而实际上，他的功劳exceed 他的mistake。并且，我们不应该过分关注名人的私生活，而应该正确评价他们的本职工作。
3， In addition，scandals are sometimes tricks played by immoral officials and stars to attack others or gain profits for oneself.政客在大选的时候歪曲事实甚至编造谎言来攻击其他选手；明星为了上头条不惜给自己制造丑闻。人们容易impressed by bad things，丑闻往往可以转移大众注意力，使真像被掩盖。 Rachelyouzai 发表于 2014-10-31 10:55 static/image/common/back.gif
I agree that scandals ensure our society to pay attention to problems that used to be hidden from su ...
4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.
I agree that scandals ensure our society to pay attention to problems that used to be hidden from supervision community and public opinion. However, the statement goes too far by failing to consider the possibility that we could overemphasize minor or fake scandals . If followed by that letter, We would probably ignore the merits besides the scandals and would even distort the facts.
If followed by that letter这是什么意思？
你的主旨句没有概括后面的主题句
1, Some social issues ought to be exposed to the public are concealed from our attention intentionally or unintentionally. 比如SARS刚刚登陆北京的时候，minister of civil health 隐瞒了实情，错失最佳防治机会。这个丑闻曝光后，人们意识到我们的emergency system of diseases 很weak and flawed。Scandals 促进社会关注及改善这样的问题。
Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
注意这道题说的是丑闻有用是因为能使我们特别关注这些问题 in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
你这个分论点并没有回应这一点
后面也是
例子其实都是相关的 分论点也是相关的 但是未能严格切题
2， In the era of mass media boom, scandals are easily wide spread and exaggerated by people who believe in them without hesitation and doubt. 比方说很多群众过分关注公众人物的丑闻而忽略他们的成就。当Bill Clinton 的 sexual scandal 被曝光的时候，他的prestige降到了最低。而实际上，他的功劳exceed 他的mistake。并且，我们不应该过分关注名人的私生活，而应该正确评价他们的本职工作。
3， In addition，scandals are sometimes tricks played by immoral officials and stars to attack others or gain profits for oneself.政客在大选的时候歪曲事实甚至编造谎言来攻击其他选手；明星为了上头条不惜给自己制造丑闻。人们容易impressed by bad things，丑闻往往可以转移大众注意力，使真像被掩盖。
tesolchina 发表于 2014-11-2 00:31 static/image/common/back.gif
4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or ref ...
老师 我感觉我的第一个分论点大致还是回应了这个“no speaker or reformer ever could”后面两个确实就偏离了这个，只是单纯的讲scandals的影响。
有一个问题想问老师，我的每一个分论点的主题句都要回应“in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could”嘛？还是主题句可以不提，在论述里面用不同的方式或者从不同的角度体现这个问题？
我回头看了下我写的作文，好像确实有一些存在不太契合的问题，我总是写着写着就变成围绕一个关键词写。。。哭。。以前没人帮忙看，自己又一直不觉得。
灰常感谢老师~~~~~~
那个“If followed by that letter”是想表达“如果那样的话”的意思。好像有点问题。换成"in that case"就差不多了。
Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.
Scandals play a monitoring role in a society. Moreover, scandals can facilitate reform. Nonetheless, the veracity of scandals should be received much attention.
1. Scandals play a monitoring role in a society. 丑闻的一个重要的作用是监督的作用。丑闻的出现会削弱公众面前的威信，如果过于严重，甚至能淘汰一部分不合格的人。比如：法国卡恩性丑闻（sexual scandal）；Nixon在政治界的水门事件Watergate；让人了解到美国民主制度遭到迫害。MIT副教授卢克范帕里耶斯（LukVanParijs）编造、修改科研数据以及杜撰合作者姓名，最终被发现报道，并被校方开除。这次现象如果不是因为丑闻的揭露，可能会被当作默认的社会潜规则（hidden rules），继续的危害社会。
2. Scandal can facilitate reform.•丑闻可以提醒人们避免犯同样的错误，促进改革。中国红十字会：“郭美美事件”促进中国红十字会的透明性；学术界的假论文丑闻的曝光是研究这们慎重对待自己的论文的独创性，使学术健康发展。
3. Nonetheless, the veracity of scandals should be received much attention. 我们要警惕其真实性。丑闻具有放大性，可能导致我们过于关注其主角的过失而忽略了去功劳。有些人正是利用了丑闻的这种特点，并处于某种目的利用丑闻来陷害别人。比如迈克尔杰克逊的猥亵儿童案，就是对方为了钱财而精心设计的圈套来陷害杰克逊骗取钱财。
raikkonen36 发表于 2014-11-3 11:30 static/image/common/back.gif
Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ...
Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.
Scandals play a monitoring role in a society. Moreover, scandals can facilitate reform. Nonetheless, the veracity of scandals should be received much attention.
你列个提纲的时候有没有认真地读题目？
Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
题目的基本论断是丑闻是有用的 然后后面有一个理由
那么你的主旨句和分论点都要回应这个论断和理由
1. Scandals play a monitoring role in a society. 丑闻的一个重要的作用是监督的作用。丑闻的出现会削弱公众面前的威信，如果过于严重，甚至能淘汰一部分不合格的人。比如：法国卡恩性丑闻（sexual scandal）；Nixon在政治界的水门事件Watergate；让人了解到美国民主制度遭到迫害。MIT副教授卢克范帕里耶斯 （LukVanParijs）编造、修改科研数据以及杜撰合作者姓名，最终被发现报道，并被校方开除。这次现象如果不是因为丑闻的揭露，可能会被当作默认 的社会潜规则（hidden rules），继续的危害社会。
我不太明白你说的monitoring role是什么意思 这种自己造词的做法会严重影响你的作文的可读性
你后面举的例子都是相关的 但是从这些例子究竟能提炼出一个怎样的回应题目的观点呢？
这其实是一个重点和难点
你需要考虑在这些丑闻中 公众的注意力是否集中到了某些问题上 这样才能回应题目
2. Scandal can facilitate reform.•丑闻可以提醒人们避免犯同样的错误，促进改革。中国红十字会：“郭美美事件”促进中国红十字会的透明性；学术界的假论文丑闻的曝光是研究 这们慎重对待自己的论文的独创性，使学术健康发展。
同样的这个分论点需要和原题结合起来讲
3. Nonetheless, the veracity of scandals should be received much attention. 我们要警惕其真实性。丑闻具有放大性，可能导致我们过于关注其主角的过失而忽略了去功劳。有些人正是利用了丑闻的这种特点，并处于某种目的利用丑闻来陷害 别人。比如迈克尔杰克逊的猥亵儿童案，就是对方为了钱财而精心设计的圈套来陷害杰克逊骗取钱财。
这个分论点也是要结合题目所讨论的scandal是否有用来写
你可以说对于那些造谣产生的丑闻 就是没有用的 你写的主题句可以作为这一段的结尾来写 主题句本身必须回应题目
其实你的基本想法都是不错的 但是在切题这一点上还要努力
Rachelyouzai 发表于 2014-10-31 10:55 static/image/common/back.gif
I agree that scandals ensure our society to pay attention to problems that used to be hidden from su ...
要不你再考一次GRE吧 要不然指导你也无法验证效果 TS：
Comparing to other news, scandals always catch our eyes. But they are not always useful. The scandals of civilians are just grandstanding of the news media to add more acquistion volume.However, it's vital for us to oversee public figures.Besides, it will play an active role in the goverment supervision and improvement.
1、The scandal among ordinary people merely warrants attention and is not worth a strw. 经常看到一些新闻总是充满着“色情”，“地域歧视”，“暴力”关键词来吸引大众的眼球，比如什么老公出轨找小三，河南人偷井盖，没有任何价值，浪费人们的时间
2、But public figures will consider scandals as alarm bell to restrain their behavior.明星被爆穿带脏话的衣服使得明星们更注意自己的着装，NBA球星艾弗森被爆家暴殴打妻子，后来道歉并改正了自己行为，成了一个好的老公
3、What's more, scandals will help goverment to correct mistakes.尼克松的水门事件，丑闻被曝光了，政府能够及时去解决处理问题。温州动车事故使得政府加大了列车安全的监管力度 ikow 发表于 2014-11-6 00:18 static/image/common/back.gif
TS：
Comparing to other news, scandals always catch our eyes. But they are not always useful. The s ...
4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.
TS：
Comparing to other news, scandals always catch our eyes. But they are not always useful. The scandals of civilians are just grandstanding of the news media to add more acquistion volume.However, it's vital for us to oversee public figures.Besides, it will play an active role in the goverment supervision and improvement.
1、The scandal among ordinary people merely warrants attention and is not worth a strw. 经常看到一些新闻总是充满着“色情”，“地域歧视”，“暴力”关键词来吸引大众的眼球，比如什么老公出轨找小三，河南人偷井盖，没有任何价值，浪费人们的 时间
2、But public figures will consider scandals as alarm bell to restrain their behavior.明星被爆穿带脏话的衣服使得明星们更注意自己的着装，NBA球星艾弗森被爆家暴殴打妻子，后来道歉并改正了自己行为，成了一个好的老公
3、What's more, scandals will help goverment to correct mistakes.尼克松的水门事件，丑闻被曝光了，政府能够及时去解决处理问题。温州动车事故使得政府加大了列车安全的监管力度
可以看出你的提纲试图将丑闻分作三类
- 普通人的丑闻
- 名人的丑闻
- 政府机构相关的丑闻
这样的分类是挺清晰的
不过我不太确定普通人和名人的丑闻有什么本质的区别 名人的丑闻很多时候不也是媒体的炒作么
或许你可以只说两种 私人的丑闻和涉及公共利益的丑闻
因为你还要留一段出来讲 the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.
或许有人会认为私人的丑闻也会暴露出社会道德伦理问题 也有用
你可以指出虽然这些问题很重要 但是讨论这些问题会牺牲个人私隐 侵犯个人的权利 是不值得的
还有一些语言表达的问题 我这里重新写一个提纲作为参考
Scandals always attract public attention in a dramatic way. Whether the scandals are useful for promoting reforms in the society depends on whether the scandals involve private individuals or public affairs.
Many scandals involving the private lives of celecrities are not useful as the media attention often violates the individual’s privacy rights and satisfy the curiosity of the public.
On the other hand, scandals related to the misconduct of government officials and insitutitions are usually helpful for reforming the policies or the government agencies.
Some people may argue that scandals about inividuals can also highlight certain moral or ethical issues that are important for the society. But focusing on these scandals is not desirable as it shows little respect of people’s basic human rights and often produce discussion primarily for entertainment rather than education.
Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.
Scandals indeed focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could. Nonetheless, scandals serve as a double-edged sword in general, meaning that scandals can impose both positive and negative influence to a society. As a whole effect in general, scandals are useful for a society.
1. Scandals can help us notice some aspects that are previously neglected. “表哥”杨达才的例子。网友在一张新闻照片上发现他戴的名表，随后不断有网友披露新的照片，指出他戴的表和腰带都是名牌，超过公务员的经济承受能力，进而引起相关部门注意，调查杨的腐败问题。如果不是照片被披露，人们不会注意到杨的贪污腐败。
2. Moreover, scandals can bring negative influence to a society. 丑闻具有放大性，可能导致我们过于关注其主角的过失, 造成伤害。 比如迈克尔杰克逊的猥亵儿童案，就是对方为了钱财而精心设计的圈套来陷害杰克逊骗取钱财。
3. Nonetheless, compared with the possibility that scandals bring negative effect to a society, the possibility that scandals impose positive effect to a society seems much larger, indicating that as a whole effect in general, scandals are useful for a society. . On the one hand, scandals play a monitoring role in a society. 丑闻的一个重要的作用是监督的作用。丑闻的出现会削弱公众面前的威信，如果过于严重，甚至能淘汰一部分不合格的人。比如：法国卡恩性丑闻（sexual scandal）；Nixon在政治界的水门事件Watergate；让人了解到美国民主制度遭到迫害。MIT副教授卢克范帕里耶斯（LukVanParijs）编造、修改科研数据以及杜撰合作者姓名，最终被发现报道，并被校方开除。这次现象如果不是因为丑闻的揭露，可能会被当作默认的社会潜规则（hidden rules），继续的危害社会。
4. On the other hand, scandals can facilitate reform.•丑闻可以提醒人们避免犯同样的错误，促进改革。中国红十字会：“郭美美事件”促进中国红十字会的透明性；学术界的假论文丑闻的曝光是研究这们慎重对待自己的论文的独创性，使学术健康发展。
老师 我的issue131 你麻烦看下 https://bbs.gter.net/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=1781246&page=1#pid1778955566
还是来锻炼一下，基础差让大家见笑了。。。
I disgree with the writter that scandles are useful than speaker or reformer because they can draw our attention more than the both mentioned above. The standard of definiting whether a things is useful doesn't depend on its popularity. We all know that many scandles are from nowhere, they are just as a measure to catch public glimpse. Besides, it is our personal interest, which is caprise and various, to decide whether scandles could draw our focusing. Moreover, scandles are still under the control of government, thus, sometimes we can't get them timely and this sap its ability as useful.
Nowadays, our daily life is full of scandles most of which we can't figure out they are real. Mostly,entertainment magazines take them as the most effective implements to catch our eyes. At first, we thought they were real but lately,did we realize they were another subtle trick.
举例我有点没想到，不过我想是否可以举个自己的想的例子。比如说，某演员因为媒体的虚假报道说其耍大牌，以至于很长一段时间许多电影公司都不想与此演员合作。
Admittedly, there are scandles come from real facts,but different people who come from different background have a colossal different penchants toward scandles. Therefor, it is very likely scandles can make any difference in case of they fail to spur the greed of paying attention to them.
举例可以举cleveland的人们比起枪击案的凶手谣传要过来，更关心James的回归。因为篮球在当地是一个不可取代的文化，长久以来他们对于篮球的关心就比他们的事情要多。
Even if scandles are useful as they are expect, we can't still ignore the influence of the government.Government always put his hands on medias, expercially, when scandles fight against its authority.
举例可以举克林顿的性丑闻。由于担心丑闻对于当时政府权威性的影响，政府在丑闻公布的时候就可以压制它的传播，采取了大量措施来降低丑闻的影响，最后在很长一段时候过后人们才真真了解到丑闻的真相，不够其影响已远不如一开始就传播开来的影响大。 tesolchina 发表于 2014-11-7 10:54 static/image/common/back.gif
4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or r ...
谢谢老师点评~~
当时分成这样三点自己感觉也是有点牵强，如果按照老师这样考虑加上“有人认为私人丑闻会暴露社会道德问题，但是会牺牲个人隐私，侵犯人权，不值得”感觉好多了
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