issue157 7月高频，主观与客观观察，必回拍！

seraph_hydeUID：184809

Issue 157
There is no such thing as purely objective observation. All observation is subjective; it is always guided by the observer's expectations or desires.

In scientific world, there is no aimless observation. All observation is leaded by a certain goal or expectation. However, nowadays, people have already noticed that the subjective factors sometimes may affected the precise and objectivity of the result, so there are a lot of new methods and machines been developed to keep the observation objectively, yet we should also never forget that sometimes objective observation can only be useful with the guidance of a subjective mind.

People today have developed many effective methods to preclude the subjective factors in the observation. A case in point is in the medical field. Before a new drug can be put in to market, it must undergoing an clinic trial to test the effectiveness and side effort etc,. Doctors, as the observer in the trial, may have a subject opinion to the result that patients who take the drug definitely will recover better than those who take placebos, and so do the patients. So to preclude the subjective factors, people have developed a new method called "blind method" to control the trial. In the blind method, neither doctors nor patients know what medicine the patients are taking, the placebos and the drugs have the exactly same appearance, smell, and taste. The only one who know which are placebos and which are drugs are the one from the drag company who is not included in the observation. In this way both the subjective factors from patients and doctors have been excluded.

To rule out the subjective factors, people also invented many new machines that can replace human observation. In the observation, different observers may have different conclusions, with the help of machine the subjective fluctuation between the conclusions of different people can be diminished. For example, in chemical experiment, people used to test the pH value by using pH value paper, which indicate pH value by changing into different colors. However, different observer may have quite different result. Red and dark red indicate pH 3 and 2 respectively, for a pH 3 solution, some people may claim that the pH is 3 because the color is red, but others may argue that the pH is 2 because they think the color is deeper than red. With the help of a new pH indicator, which detect pH by electric signals of the solution, the subject differences between people's sensitivity of colors can be eliminated, and a more precise result can be provided.

Although more and more observations are becoming more and more objective, we should always remember that sometimes without the guidance of a subjective mind, the results of objective observation are meaningless. All the results of observation should be organized and arranged to found certain rules among them, and all these course can only be done under the lead of a subjective mind, that is a mind that with expectations and desires. For instance, people had began to record the observation of comet long time ago, however not until Halley began to consider the relationship between the record, those observers just simply wrote down time and location of the comets they found. Halley, after a thorough comparing of several observations, had found that some record had a similarity of period. He further induce that those records refer to a unique comet, the comet that is now well known to all-the Halley's comet. Without Halley's subjective hypothesis and expectation, the records of comets were just useless documents.

To sum up, objective observation now is available by the use of new method and powerful machines, however the results of observation sometimes still need the guidance of a subjective mind.

nickaaronleeUID：183378

In scientific world, there is no aimless observation. All observation is leaded by a certain goal or expectation. However, nowadays, people have already noticed that the subjective factors sometimes may affected the precise and objectivity of the result, so there are a lot of new methods and machines been developed to keep the observation objectively, yet we should also never forget that sometimes objective observation can only be useful with the guidance of a subjective mind.

People today have developed many effective methods to preclude the subjective factors in the observation. A case in point is in the medical field. Before a new drug can be put in to market, it must undergoing an clinic trial to test the effectiveness and side effort etc,. Doctors, as the observer in the trial, may have a subject opinion to the result that patients who take the drug definitely will recover better than those who take placebos, and so do the patients. So to preclude the subjective factors, people have developed a new method called "blind method" to control the trial. In the blind method, neither doctors nor patients know what medicine the patients are taking, the placebos and the drugs have the exactly same appearance, smell, and taste. The only one who know which are placebos and which are drugs are the one from the drag company who is not included in the observation. In this way both the subjective factors from patients and doctors have been excluded.我觉得你的例子写得太详细了，应该分析为主

To rule out the subjective factors, people also invented many new machines that can replace human observation. In the observation, different observers may have different conclusions, with the help of machine the subjective fluctuation between the conclusions of different people can be diminished. For example, in chemical experiment, people used to test the pH value by using pH value paper, which indicate pH value by changing into different colors. However, different observer may have quite different result. Red and dark red indicate pH 3 and 2 respectively, for a pH 3 solution, some people may claim that the pH is 3 because the color is red, but others may argue that the pH is 2 because they think the color is deeper than red. With the help of a new pH indicator, which detect pH by electric signals of the solution, the subject differences between people's sensitivity of colors can be eliminated, and a more precise result can be provided.和上面一段一样，例子写得太详细，ph纸如何在相近的酸度下颜色也相近可以一笔呆过，关键看的是结果

Although more and more observations are becoming more and more objective, we should always remember that sometimes without the guidance of a subjective mind, the results of objective observation are meaningless. All the results of observation should be organized and arranged to found certain rules among them, and all these course can only be done under the lead of a subjective mind, that is a mind that with expectations and desires. For instance, people had began to record the observation of comet long time ago, however not until Halley began to consider the relationship between the record, those observers just simply wrote down time and location of the comets they found. Halley, after a thorough comparing of several observations, had found that some record had a similarity of period. He further induce that those records refer to a unique comet, the comet that is now well known to all-the Halley's comet. Without Halley's subjective hypothesis and expectation, the records of comets were just useless documents.结尾再总结一下比较好

To sum up, objective observation now is available by the use of new method and powerful machines, however the results of observation sometimes still need the guidance of a subjective mind.
写得蛮好的，就是例子方面可以再简练一些，关键在于分析，我拍了你，也请你拍拍我哦

xiaonawangUID：2114716

Issue 157
There is no such thing as purely objective observation. All observation is subjective; it is always guided by the observer's expectations or desires.

In scientific world, there is no aimless observation. All observation is leaded by a certain goal or expectation. However, nowadays, people have already noticed that the subjective factors sometimes may affected the precise and objectivity of the result, so there are a lot of new methods and machines been developed to keep the observation objectively, yet we should also never forget that sometimes objective observation can only be useful with the guidance of a subjective mind.

People today have developed many effective methods to preclude the subjective factors in the observation. A case in point is in the medical field. Before a new drug can be put in to market, it must undergoing an clinic trial to test the effectiveness and side effort etc,. Doctors, as the observer in the trial, may have a subject opinion to the result that patients who take the drug definitely will recover better than those who take placebos, and so do the patients. So to preclude the subjective factors, people have developed a new method called "blind method" to control the trial. In the blind method, neither doctors nor patients know what medicine the patients are taking, the placebos and the drugs have the exactly same appearance, smell, and taste. The only one who know which are placebos and which are drugs are the one from the drag company who is not included in the observation. In this way both the subjective factors from patients and doctors have been excluded.（这里的例子可以证明你的分论点吗？）

To rule out the subjective factors, people also invented many new machines that can replace human observation. In the observation, different observers may have different conclusions, with the help of machine the subjective fluctuation between the conclusions of different people can be diminished. For example, in chemical experiment, people used to test the pH value by using pH value paper, which indicate pH value by changing into different colors. However, different observer may have quite different result. Red and dark red indicate pH 3 and 2 respectively, for a pH 3 solution, some people may claim that the pH is 3 because the color is red, but others may argue that the pH is 2 because they think the color is deeper than red. With the help of a new pH indicator, which detect pH by electric signals of the solution, the subject differences between people's sensitivity of colors can be eliminated, and a more precise result can be provided.(这一段和上一段意思上是否有些重复？)

Although more and more observations are becoming more and more objective, we should always remember that sometimes without the guidance of a subjective mind, the results of objective observation are meaningless. All the results of observation should be organized and arranged to found certain rules among them, and all these course can only be done under the lead of a subjective mind, that is a mind that with expectations and desires（我认为这个定义不好）. For instance, people had began to record the observation of comet long time ago, however not until Halley began to consider the relationship between the record, those observers just simply wrote down time and location of the comets they found. Halley, after a thorough comparing of several observations, had found that some record had a similarity of period. He further induce that those records refer to a unique comet, the comet that is now well known to all-the Halley's comet. Without Halley's subjective hypothesis and expectation, the records of comets were just useless documents.（哈雷的例子很好，但是我觉得用在这里说哈雷是在带着强烈的主观感觉在做记录，好像不妥。相反，这个例子正说明哈雷不急躁，思路更冷静，沉着，客观。你觉得呢？）

To sum up, objective observation now is available by the use of new method and powerful machines, however the results of observation sometimes still need the guidance of a subjective mind.（我承认人的思想是主观的，但是不能这么忽略人的思想中忠实于事实的客观因素。就好比哈雷的例子，不能说明主观的重要性。可不可以这样说，同样哈雷的例子，你可以强调哈雷的Tenacity, 毅力品质等主观因素，我认为这比强调subjective hypothesis and expectation更能突出主观性，你觉得呢？ ）

总体框架很好。可是，论点阐发上好像深度不够。不知道你同意吗？
有人，这样开头，我觉得更深刻一些。
The speaker claims that all observation is subjective-colored by desire and expectation. While it would be tempting to concede that we all see things differently, careful scrutiny of the speaker's claim reveals that it confuses observation with interpretation.

[ Last edited by xiaonawang on 2005-7-22 at 11:47 ]

seraph_hydeUID：184809

Originally posted by nickaaronlee at 2005-7-22 11:26
In scientific world, there is no aimless observation. All observation is leaded by a certain goal or expectation. However, nowadays, people have already noticed that the subjective factors sometime ...

thank you ！nickaaronlee

马上就给你去改～～

seraph_hydeUID：184809

Originally posted by xiaonawang at 2005-7-22 11:42
Issue 157
There is no such thing as purely objective observation. All observation is subjective; it is always guided by the observer's expectations or desires.

In scientific ...

Thank you !!xiaonawang
你说得没错，但是我实在想不出来怎么再深入了～～可不可以把那篇文章得连接给我呢，我想看看他得分论点是怎么写得～～
thank you～～
还有你得文章连接，我好回拍啊～～

seraph_hydeUID：184809

dindindinding~~

tz0412UID：180794

In scientific world, there is no aimless observation. All observation is leaded by a certain goal or expectation. However, nowadays, people have already noticed that the subjective factors sometimes may affected the precise (precision) and objectivity of the result, so there are a lot of new methods and machines been(being) developed to keep the observation objectively(objective), yet we should also never forget that sometimes objective observation can only be useful with the guidance of a subjective mind.
开头的那两句话总觉得有点不太舒服，但又不知道该怎么写才好。

People today have developed many effective methods to preclude the subjective factors in the observation. A case in point is in the medical field. Before a new drug can be put in to (the )market, it must undergoing (undergo?)an clinic trial to test the effectiveness and side effort etc,. Doctors, as the observer in the trial(as可以不要,整个结构就做同位语，另外，observer应该是复数吧/）, may have a subject opinion to the result that patients who take the drug definitely will recover better than those who take placebos, and so do the patients. So to preclude the subjective factors, people have developed a new method called "blind method" to control the trial. In the blind method, neither doctors nor patients know what medicine the patients are taking, the placebos and the drugs have the exactly same appearance, smell, and taste. The only one who know which are placebos and which are drugs are the one from the drag company who is（和前面主谓不一致了，到底是一个人还是多个人啊？） not included in the observation. In this way both the subjective factors from patients and doctors have been excluded.

To rule out the subjective factors, people also invented many new machines that can replace human observation. In the observation, different observers may have different conclusions, with the help of machine the subjective fluctuation between the conclusions of different people can be diminished. For example, in chemical experiment, people used to test the pH value by using pH value paper, which indicate pH value by changing into different colors. However, different observer may have quite different result. Red and dark red indicate pH 3 and 2 respectively, for a pH 3 solution, some people may claim that the pH is 3 because the color is red, but others may argue that the pH is 2 because they think the color is deeper than red. With the help of a new pH indicator, which detect pH by electric signals of the solution, the subject differences between people's sensitivity of colors can be eliminated, and a more precise result can be provided.（例子和分论点结合得不错，看来楼主是学医的）

Although more and more observations are becoming more and more objective(more and more结构太重复了八？）, we should always remember that sometimes without the guidance of a subjective mind, the results of objective observation are meaningless. All the results of observation should be organized and arranged to found certain rules among them, and all these course can only be done under the lead of a subjective mind, that is a mind that with expectations and desires. For instance, people had began to record the observation of comet long time ago, however not until Halley began to consider the relationship between the record, those observers just simply wrote down time and location of the comets they found. Halley, after a thorough comparing of several observations, had found that some record had a similarity of period. He further induce that those records refer to a unique comet, the comet that is now well known to all-the Halley's comet. Without Halley's subjective hypothesis and expectation, the records of comets were just useless documents. 关于这个例子，同意前面有位G友的看法，它只能说明对结果的理解需要人类的思想，但不能说明需要的是主观的思想，对吧？

To sum up, objective observation now is available by the use of new method and powerful machines, however the results of observation sometimes still need the guidance of a subjective mind. 结尾对前文的总结比较好，还可以再写长一点，要显得有始有终嘛：）

我拍了你，也希望你能来拍我啊 :lol

seraph_hydeUID：184809

谢谢了！ 可是你也要把帖子得地址留下啊～～

tz0412UID：180794

Originally posted by seraph_hyde at 2005-7-22 14:26
谢谢了！ 可是你也要把帖子得地址留下啊～～

我也写了这篇的。 https://bbs.gter.net/viewthre ... ge=1&highlight=
出发点和你的不一样，大家相互多拍啊：）谢了