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发表于 2009-12-25 09:42:26 |只看该作者 |倒序浏览
关于REBORN FROM THE ASHES组COMMENTS活动的说明&汇总
https://bbs.gter.net/thread-1042733-1-2.html


----------------------------
这是接着上次的后续部分

Rebuttal statements

The moderator's rebuttal remarks
Oct 23rd 2009 | Adrian Wooldridge  

It seems that experts are just as passionate on the subject of executive pay as the general public.
Mr Kaplan argues that the most powerful criticism of executive pay-that bosses get upside and no downside-is simply false. He points out that three of the most maligned bosses in the financial services sector, Vikram Pandit of Citigroup, John Mack of Morgan Stanley and Kenneth Lewis of Bank of America, all lost small fortunes in 2008. CEOs as a group lost roughly 40% of their wealth in 2008.
Ms Minow argues that her rebuttal is being written by the headlines. Financial service companies are once again paying huge bonuses despite the fact that their companies have been propped up by public money. She points out that CEOs enjoy the unique privilege of being able to appoint the people who decide their pay. She also reiterates the point that there are plenty of devices such as golden parachutes that cannot possibly be justified by performance.
In his expert evidence Rakesh Khurana tries to focus on fundamental questions such as what the purpose of compensation is. He argues that the market for CEOs is a highly distorted one because CEOs themselves can influence the process and performance is hard to measure. He suggests that extreme pay differentials can damage companies by attracting the wrong sort of bosses and demotivating the rank and file. He also worries about the legitimacy of the system. One survey suggests that only 13% of people trust what CEOs say.
So far the voting is going heavily against the motion. But I wonder how far this is driven by emotion rather than a reasoned assessment of the evidence. I would urge the participants to pay close attention to the wording of the motion-particularly the key phrases 'one the whole' and 'deserve'. We need to focus more on the overall picture, around the world as well as in the United States, rather than on a few attention-grabbing anecdotes. And we need to think more closely about the word 'deserve'. Mr Kaplan's best chance of turning the voting around is to demonstrate that outstanding bosses can boost the performance of the organisations that they head, not only earning their pay but also benefitting workers, shareholders and consumers.


The proposer's rebuttal remarks
Oct 23rd 2009 | Steven N. Kaplan

Nell Minow argues that top executive compensation was a major cause of the financial crisis. She bases her conclusion on two "outlier" examples, Angelo Mozillo and Aubrey McClendon, that she calls "anecdotes". The plural of anecdote is data. And the data, that is the pay at a broad sample of financial companies, simply do not support her conclusion. Ironically, neither do her two anecdotes.
Ms Minow makes the following claims. (1) Incentive compensation rewarded top financial executives for the quantity of transactions, not the quality. (2) Top CEOs, like Mr Mozillo, took large amounts of money out of their companies before their companies failed. (3) The CEOs knew they were making bad investments, but did so anyway because they could make more money doing so. (4) CEOs get upside, but no downside. (5) The post-meltdown awards create incentives that reward management, but damage shareholders and everyone else.
These claims are false. As David Yermack of NYU pointed out in a recent piece in the Wall Street Journal, Vikram Pandit of Citigroup, John Mack of Morgan Stanley and Kenneth Lewis of Bank of America:
"all lost small fortunes in 2008. The 2008 compensation of Messrs Pandit, Mack, and Lewis was approximately minus $105 million, minus $40 million, and minus $108 million, respectively, after taking account of the losses on the stock that each CEO owned in his firm. Other CEOs in the financial industry had similarly bad years. Kerry Killinger of Washington Mutual lost more than $25 million before being ousted in September, Kennedy Thompson of Wachovia lost more than $30 million before being fired in June, and Jeffrey Immelt of General Electric lost more than $60 million ... These CEOs' financial reversals were part of a robust system of pay-for-performance widely used by most U.S. companies."
Yermack also points out that James Cayne lost most of his billion-dollar fortune when Bear Stearns failed and Richard Fuld of Lehman Brothers lost hundreds of millions of dollars.
The fact is that most financial-company CEOs received the lion's share of their pay in stock and options. And they kept most of that pay as shares in their companies which they never cashed in. When the crisis hit and their stock prices sank, those CEOs lost a large fraction of their wealth and, in many cases, their jobs.
As I wrote in my first entry, this is true, in general, of the overall CEO market. CEOs earn a lot and their stock appreciates when their companies perform well. CEOs lose large amounts of wealth and their jobs when their companies perform poorly. It is irresponsible to claim that CEOs do not bear any downside risk. In 2008, CEOs as a group lost roughly 40% of their wealth.
In direct contradiction to Ms Minow's conclusion, the financial CEOs were compensated in the end for the quality of their transactions. The CEOs did not take much off the table. The CEOs had a substantial amount of downside risk. In fact, those CEOs would have been much better off if they had not engaged in the transactions they did.
It is worth adding that David Yermack is a noted researcher on CEO pay who studies large samples over long periods. He has written several articles highly critical of specific CEO pay practices, like corporate jet usage. Nevertheless, his conclusion on the relation of CEO pay to the financial crisis is diametrically opposed to Ms Minow's (as is his characterisation of the CEO market in general).
A study of CEO incentives in a broader group of financial institutions during the crisis by Rudi Fahlenbrach and Rene Stulz of Ohio State (and a former president of the American Finance Association) confirms Yermack's analysis and also clearly refutes Ms Minow's conclusion.
Ironically, even her two anecdotes about Angelo Mozillo of Countrywide and Aubrey McClendon of Chesapeake Energy fail to support her case.
Unlike the other CEOs mentioned above (and most financial-institution CEOs), Mr Mozillo did manage to sell a lot of his stock. Unfortunately for him, the SEC has charged him with securities fraud and insider trading. And it is unlikely to lead to a good outcome for him. If found guilty, he potentially will end up paying three times what he took out. Clearly, he appears to have behaved badly, but he did not get away with it.
As for Mr McClendon, he runs an energy company. How could he possibly have had anything to do with the financial crisis?
The preponderance of the data and, even Ms Minow's "outlier" "anecdotes," therefore, fail to provide any evidence that top executive compensation had much to do with the financial crisis.
Top executive compensation did not cause the financial crisis. Instead, the crisis was caused by loose monetary policy, a global capital glut, over-high leverage at investment banks, mandates from Congress to provide mortgages to people who could not afford them, flawed ratings from the rating agencies and poor incentives at mortgage origination (not the CEO) level. Consistent with this, the financial crisis has spread to financial institutions in other countries with very different pay practices.


The opposition's rebuttal remarks
Oct 23rd 2009 |  Nell Minow

The headlines are writing my rebuttal for me.
GoldmanSachs set aside $16.7 billion for compensation and benefits in thefirst nine months of 2009, up 46% from a year ago. While its net incomehas tripled, its core investment banking business is down 31%. The Toronto Star quotesGoldman's CFO, David Viniar, using an unforgivable oxymoron in aconference call with reporters: "Our competitors are paying peoplequite well [and are] very willing to pay employees guaranteed bonuses of very high amounts." (emphasis added)
MrViniar also showed that he has a very short memory, arguing thatGoldman is operating without any government guarantee, ignoring thereality of the government guarantee that kept the system going just ayear ago.
These bonuses have nothing to do with paying forperformance. How much of Goldman's bouncing back is due to thegovernment's guarantees and the hundreds of billions of dollars itpoured into Goldman, Wall Street, and other subsidies and outrightwelfare payments to the very institutions that came close to bringingdown the entire economy? Shouldn't the American people expect some sortof discounted calculation of the bonuses that reflect a market-basedassessment of performance? Once again, Wall Street is all aboutcapitalism when it comes to the upside, but all about socialism when itcomes to the downside, that is, from each, according to his ability, toeach, whatever he can get away with.
Also this week, we had thetestimony of Neil Barofsky, the special inspector general for thegovernment's financial rescue programme before the House Committee onOversight and Government Reform. The serial offender AIG has promised$198m in bonus pay to its employees next March, according to thetestimony, and there is very little the government or anyone else cando about it. Because the bonus agreements were entered into before thebailout, the government has no legal authority to stop them. AllSpecial Master Kenneth Feinberg can do is ask the company not to paythe bonuses and rattle his sabre about the pay he can control goingforward, hoping that the threat of clamping down on the 25 executivesat each of the covered companies he does have authority over will beenough of an incentive to force a change. In the meantime, once again,pay is uncoupled from performance. Even the company has given up ontrying to make that case, relying instead on opportunity costs tojustify the bonuses and arguing that these kinds of payments arenecessary in order to keep the employees from leaving. Based on theirpast performance and their unwillingness to tie future pay to genuinemeasures of sustainable growth, I suggest that the best choice forshareholders is to let them leave.
Mr Barofksy gave thecommittee a Treasury Department report on the last set of outrageousAIG bonuses. It concluded in part that "Treasury invested $40 billionof taxpayer funds in AIG, designed AIG's contractual executivecompensation restrictions, and helped manage the Government's majoritystake in AIG for several months, all without having any detailedinformation about the scope of AIG's very substantial, and verycontroversial, executive compensation obligations." If a private entityhad been asked for emergency funds, it is unthinkable that any moneywould have been advanced without establishing some control overcompensation. There are two reasons for this. The first is agencycosts. Anyone (other than Secretary Henry Paulson, apparently) puttingmoney at risk will want to ensure that it will not be inappropriatelyappropriated. The second is the high likelihood that the previousincentive structure was a significant factor in the bad decisions andcatastrophic risk management that created the need for the funds in thefirst place.
And really, that is all the argument one needs. Bydefinition, the incentive compensation was badly designed, as proved bythe results. However, I will respond to some of the points raised byProfessor Kaplan.
First, we disagree on the calculations thatsupport the conclusion that CEO play has been declining. Our figures,based not on theoretical pay but on realised pay, are as follows.


Clearly actual pay is the better measure of pay effectiveness. Ialso question the validity of the Equilar survey figures. They arebased on the reported total compensation in the summary compensationtable, which is even further from reality than the "expected pay", asit is just an accounting cost.
I do not understand why hebrings up the net worth of CEOs; that has no relationship whatsoever totheir pay, its relationship to performance, or its effectiveness ataligning CEOs' interests with shareholders'.
Second, ProfessorKaplan states, "The typical CEO is paid for performance. Boardsincreasingly fire CEOs for poor performance." The second sentence hasno relationship to the first. Boards may fire CEOs for poorperformance, but they pay them boatloads of money for that performanceon the way out of the door. Just look at Ken Lewis's departure fromBank of America. Disastrous performance that apparently included lying(about what else? bonuses) and an unprecedented vote of no confidencefrom shareholders that removed him as chairman, may indeed have causedhim to be fired (though the board did not use that term). But his $53mretirement package does not feel like pay for performance to me.
ProfessorKaplan tries to obscure the point by bringing in law firm partners,athletes and other highly-paid professionals. Partners in law firms arepaid according to formulas set by the partnership. As in any otherprivate firm, there are no agency costs to worry about and they can dowhatever they like. Athletes, movie stars and recording artists, whohave a much greater range and far greater elasticity in compensation,engage in vigorous arm's length negotiations on pay; their pay is notset by boards they appoint, as CEOs' is.
And it is hard for meto understand how anyone could point to the US or UK governmentauthorising excessive pay as a validation of the system. As notedabove, the government has repeatedly failed as regulator or as providerof capital in curbing outrageously destructive executive compensation.
Here are seven deadly sins found in executive compensation plans.Each of them is conclusive evidence that the system is out of whack.
1.    Making up for losses in stock value with other grants of cash or stock.
2.    Imputed years of service to increase retirement benefits.
3.    Setting the performance goals too low or other phony metrics to trigger bonuses.
4.    Dividends on unvested stock.
5.    Outrageous departure packages.
6.    Stock options that are not performance-based or indexed.
7.    Perquisites and gross-ups.

In my next response, I will explain how to do it right.


http://www.economist.com/debate/days/view/403
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沙发
发表于 2009-12-25 09:49:40 |只看该作者
本帖最后由 adammaksim 于 2009-12-26 12:21 编辑

prop up  支持,资助

the rank and file  file:a row of persons, animals,or things arranged one behind the other

oust  : to remove or dispossess

It it worth adding that David Yermack is a noted researcher on CEO pay who studies large samples over long periods.

preponderance 优势

leverage 杠杆作用

CFO=cheif financial officer

oxymoron 矛盾修饰法

outright ad./aj.  坦率地,彻底地

be uncoupled from  与什么无关(解耦)

likelihood=possibility  

Equilar=Equilar is a California-based company that provides information about total executive compensation packages of the top officers at publicly traded companies.

whatsoever ad.(用于否定语气中加强语气)任何  
that has no relationship whatsoever to their pay   


boatloads of money   boatloads of = lots of

out of whack  not working together correctly

phony adj.假的

Once again, Wall Street is all about capitalism when it comes to the upside, but all about socialism when it comes to the downside, that is, from each, according to his ability, to each, whatever he can get away with.
each 就指 downside     后一个应该是指upside        整体的意思应该是说在华尔街大部分下层的钱被共产主义了,来养活那些少数的高层

comments: In their rebuttal statements both sides present more insightful debates. And once again I choose to support Mr. Kaplan's side.As I have said in yesterday's comments the fundamental difference between Mr. Kaplan and Ms. Minow in giving evidence is Mr. Kaplan tend to inform us with accurate date, "the plural of anecdote", which contributes to his argument's objection and persuasion and, to the contrast, Ms. Minow once again focuses to much on some examples.

However, today's remark also reveals some flaws of Mr. Kaplan's debate. First, he gives out few evidence to demonstrate outstanding bosses can boost the performance the organizations they head, which is significant to strengthen his  reasoning. Second, as Ms. Minow points out, Mr. Kaplan's bringing in of law firm partners, athletes and other highly-paid professionals as frame of reference for CEOs is unreasonable, for "CEOs enjoys the unique privilege to appoint the people who decide their pay."Third, in some cases, for example the golden parachutes, Mr. Kaplan's claim that CEO is paid for their performance is untenable.

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板凳
发表于 2009-12-25 12:20:42 |只看该作者
本帖最后由 splendidsun 于 2009-12-28 18:47 编辑

占楼~~
My Comment
As I have mentioned last time, the first round of the debate likes making an issue task. While in the rebuttal statement, both sides seem to write arguments. Especially, in the part of the proposer the whole structure of his remarks could be regarded as an argument. First, he concludes the points of the defender. Then he points out several unreasonable points and refutes each one in details. For the content of this debate, I can’t fully understand all the points and the examples that the proposer and the defender cite. What I have got form this rebuttal remarks are including following points: first, the top executives play key roles in the management and operation. Their compensations are much higher than the rank and file, which is determined not only by their performances. During the financial crisis, many executives were fired by the boards. But they could gain a large amount of money for their retirement. Meanwhile, others are suffering the difficulties that the recession brought.
prop up 支撑
reiterate 重申
golden parachute——黄金保护伞
A golden parachute is an agreement between a company and an employee (usually upper executive) specifying that the employee will receive certain significant benefits if employment is terminated. Sometimes, certain conditions, typically a change in company ownership, must be met, but often the cause of termination is unspecified. These benefits may include severance pay, cash bonuses, stock options, or other benefits. They are designed to reduce perverse incentives—paradoxically (and ironically) they may create them.

the rank and file老百姓,普通职员
extreme pay differentials
boost 促进
compensation 薪金
top executive 最高行政管理人员
Incentive compensation奖金
meltdown 暴跌
take account of 考虑到
robust健康的,强健的
the lion's share最大份额的
cash in 兑现
noted 著名的
diametrically直接的
insider trading内线交易
get away with it侥幸成功,逃脱处罚
global capital glut全球的资本过饱和
loose monetary policy宽松的货币政策
mortgage抵押贷款
net income净收益
bounce back反弹,恢复活力
subsidy津贴
testimony证言
bailout救助
clamp down on 压制
sustainable growth可持续增长
accounting cost会计成本
arm's length 公平的
Dividends红利
Perquisite津贴
Pay is uncoupled from performance
不懂的句子:
Once again, Wall Street is all about capitalism when it comes to the upside, but all about socialism when it comes to the downside, that is, from each, according to his ability, toeach, whatever he can get away with.
阳光,微笑,我喜欢~~

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地板
发表于 2009-12-25 13:02:37 |只看该作者
占楼

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GRE梦想之帆

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发表于 2009-12-25 15:52:33 |只看该作者
prop up 支撑支持  the rank and file普通士兵们 老百姓 Incentive compensation奖金 cash in 兑现 收到货款  refute驳倒 反驳 oxymoron矛盾修饰法 rattle his sabre 以战争恐吓 clamp down on  施压于。。。 uncoupled 分解分开  Treasury Department 财政部 phony假冒的 disastrous损失惨重的 悲伤的  corporate jet 公司商务机,公司为商务旅行而购买的专用机型  
1  But I wonder how far this is driven by emotion rather than a reasoned assessment of the evidence. 怎么感觉翻译出来的前后意思不对?
是不是说  我怀疑这个数据到底有多少是一时冲动而不是合理的数据推论而写出来的?
2  Mr Kaplan's best chance of turning the voting around is to demonstrate that outstanding bosses can boost the performance of the organisations that they head, not only earning their pay but also benefitting workers, shareholders and consumers.
3 And the data, that is the pay at a broad sample of financial companies, simply do not support her conclusion. Ironically, neither do her two anecdotes. 什么意思?
4  Instead, the crisis was caused by loose monetary policy, a global capital glut, over-high leverage at investment banks, mandates from Congress to provide mortgages to people who could not afford them, flawed ratings from the rating agencies and poor incentives at mortgage origination (not the CEO) level.
5 Once again, Wall Street is all about capitalism when it comes to the upside, but all about socialism when itcomes to the downside, that is, from each, according to his ability, to each, whatever he can get away with. 这句话什么意思呀?
6  But his $53mretirement package does not feel like pay for performance to me.

From the later comment on two opposite opinions, we can clearly got the overall deeper insight of the financial crisis and the exeutive pay issue. And i have to admit the comprehensive explanation and quotation really convicing me to believe that we should keep neutral attitude before we set out to probe and pry.


We can get the first claimation that the finnancial crisis including subprime crisis has nothing to do with executive overpayment. Ironically, the victom maybe also the arch-criminal. The inducement for crisis comes from loose monetary policy, a global capital glut, over-high leverage at investment banks, mandates from Congress to provide mortgages to people who could not afford them, flawed ratings from the rating agencies and poor incentives at mortgage origination (not the CEO) level.

As every coin has two sides, we can comprehend some big guns deserve what they earn whereas others not. From the point, we can totally understand populace's outrage about the exeutive salary without reflecting market based assessment of performence.

To rebut the other one, authore let us know that he also question the validity of the survey figures. And this irrelevant statistics which does not have any relationship with pay, performence or unity of CEO with shareholders just vague the audiences opinion. Exepting the upside argument, it is also doubtful if they are really paid for performance. Were i walking out of the door with a boatloads of money, i would say i like to be fired everyday.

Coming to the last, but not the end of the debate, we can know we still have a long way to go to reform our deficient system.

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发表于 2009-12-25 16:28:57 |只看该作者
3 And the data, that is the pay at a broad sample of financial companies, simply do not support her conclusion. Ironically, neither do her two anecdotes. 什么意思?
tequilawine 发表于 2009-12-25 15:52

意思是 her two anecdotes(她之前用两个传闻当作论据) neither do not support her conclusion.


5 Once again, Wall Street is all about capitalism when it comes to the upside, but all about socialism when itcomes to the downside, that is, from each, according to his ability, to each, whatever he can get away with. 这句话什么意思呀?

这句话我也不理解,尤其是后半句好像省略了很多。

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发表于 2009-12-25 16:35:23 |只看该作者
本帖最后由 aladdin.ivy 于 2009-12-25 16:36 编辑

背景知识

金色降落伞
Golden Parachute
  [词条释义]
  金色降落伞也称黄金降落伞,是指按照聘用合同中公司控制权变动条款对高层管理人员进行补偿的规定,金色降落伞规定在目标公司被收购的情况下,公司高层管理人员无论是主动还是被迫离开公司,都可以得到一笔巨额安置补偿费用。
  [释义延伸]
  金色降落伞制度最早产生于美国,“金色”意指补偿丰厚,“降落伞”意指高管可规避公司控制权变动带来的冲击而实现平稳过渡。这种让收购者“大出血”的策略,属于反收购的“毒丸计划”之一。其原理可扩大适用到经营者各种原因的退职补偿。巨额的补偿方案使收购方的收购成本增加,成为抵御恶意收购的一种防御措施。但其弊端是,但也有可能诱导管理层低价出售企业。
  我国企业也可以大胆吸收“金色降落伞”制度的精髓,合理安排企业经营者的退出机制。与之相配套的还有金手铐(针对股权)和金阶梯(针对职业成长),并称“三金”,适用于核心管理团队,特别是企业家阶层,具有程序严、弹性大、价值高等特点。
  [实用指针]
  金色降落伞制度在中国应用时应注意的问题:
  1.授予的对象的确定 金色降落伞在国外的授予对象主要是企业的高级管理人员,但由于我国企业中存在“元老问题”的主要是国有企业,企业的成长过程中对企业作过重要贡献的人员较多,因此授予的面应该相对放宽,因包括企业的创业者或企业的成长过程中对企业的发展起过重要作用的人员,如公司的业务骨干、技术骨干等。
  2.金色降落伞的授予形式 西方国家的金色降落伞主要包括一次性的契约解除补偿金、津贴和股票期权等。在我国大部分企业领导人领到的是一笔退休金。而按照我国现行的退休制度,每月发放一定的退休金是必然的选择,其余的可以包括一次性的奖金或是股票期权。
  3.授予金额的限制 美国在其《国内税收法案》中就对金色降落伞金额作了限定,即被授予人在“突发事件”前的五年以内的各年工资的平均值。如果超出这个限额,就要对其超出的部分征收20%的税款,而同时公司也会失去相当于超出授予部分的税收减免。由于我国的企业元老们的工资收入远远低于西方发达国家,因此,对数额的限制应适当放宽,每月的退休金应以不低于其在位时工资为限,并应考虑到国内同类型企业的水平,其总额应与元老在位时企业的经营情况、元老在职时间的长短、元老对企业的贡献大小等多方面进行衡量。
  [经典案例]
  在美国,公司里最痛苦的离别一直是由最甜蜜的经济奖励开道的,许多公司都为高官退休后的平稳着陆提供了“黄金降落伞”。不过,股东和投资者对“为一个失败的CEO支付高额退职福利”感到愤慨。
  2008年,就在华尔街风暴当中一个个金融公司接连垮掉,员工丢掉饭碗的同时,这些公司的高管却带着“黄金降落伞”离开——获得数以千万美元计的巨额离职费。随着华尔街危机的蔓延,这些破产企业高管的天价报酬激起了众怒。美国财长保尔森表示将“支持限制金融机构高管薪资,以化解国会议员的疑虑”。
  [相关词条]
  锡降落伞 灰色降落伞
  内容摘自柏明顿《人力资源管理词典》 
  “金色降落伞”是按照聘用合同中公司控制权变动条款对高层管理人员进行补偿的规定,最早产生在美国。“金色”意指补偿丰厚,“降落伞”意指高管可规避公司控制权变动带来的冲击而实现平稳过渡。这种让收购者“大出血”的策略,属于反收购的“毒丸计划”之一。
  在公司并购与反并购中,“降落伞计划”是目标公司设置的,旨在防止发生收购者在公司并购完成后对目标公司的管理人员和普通员工进行解雇的策略。为了解决目标公司管理人员及普通员工的可能会被解雇的后顾之忧,美国的公司首先创设了降落伞这一策略。在实际操作中,降落伞计划一般分为金降落伞、银色降落伞和锡降落伞。
  金降落伞计划主要是针对目标公司的董事会成员和高级管理人员的。在公司并购之前,由目标公司董事会通过决议,由公司董事及高层管理人员与目标公司签订合同,约定在目标公司被并购接管后,目标公司的董事及高层管理人员被解雇的时候,可一次性领到巨额的退休金、股票期权收入或额外津贴。目标公司董事和高级管理人员的这种收益就象一把降落伞,让高层管理者从高高的职位上安全下来,故名"降落伞"计划;又因其收益丰厚如金,故名"金降落伞".。

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发表于 2009-12-25 16:39:25 |只看该作者
本帖最后由 aladdin.ivy 于 2009-12-25 16:49 编辑

背景知识

矛盾修饰法 oxymoron
  A rhetorical figure in which incongruous or contradictory terms are combined, as in a deafening silence and a mournful optimist.
  矛盾修饰法:一种把互相矛盾或不调和的词合在一起的修辞手法,如在震耳欲聋的沉默 和 悲伤的乐观
  所谓矛盾修辞法(Oxymoron)是指将语义截然相反对立的词语放在一起使用,来揭示某一项事物矛盾性质的一种修辞手法。换言之,它使用两种不相协调,甚至截然相反的特征来形容一项事物,以增强语言感染力。在阅读理解解码过程中,矛盾修辞法可以产生出两种强烈的修辞效果。第一,出人意料。由于两部分语义相互矛盾,合并使用有悖常理,所以矛盾修辞强烈碰撞读者的神经思维,起到意想不到,启发思维的作用,为进一步深化理解奠定了基础。例如英语的cruel kindness,汉语的“真实的谎言”和“甜美的复仇”便是矛盾修辞法的具体表现。读到上述那样的矛盾词语组合读者肯定会有出乎意料的感觉。第二,引人入胜。矛盾词语的冲击会激发读者进一步深化理解的欲望。在仔细推敲这种看似矛盾的语言表达之后,读者会发现矛盾修辞法所表示的语义矛盾不仅符合逻辑,而且使文章更加形象生动,意蕴丰富且深刻。例如徐志摩的《赠日本女郎》一诗:
  赠日本女郎
  最是那一低头的温柔,
  像一朵水莲花不胜凉风的娇羞,
  道一声珍重,道一声珍重,
  那一声珍重里有蜜甜的忧愁——
  沙扬娜拉!
  
  这是徐志摩于1924年陪泰戈尔游历东瀛岛国日本时写的长诗《沙扬娜拉十八首》中的最后一首。这首玲珑之作表现了浪漫诗人的灵动与风流情怀。诗中末尾的“密甜的忧愁”作为全诗的诗眼,就是运用了矛盾修辞法。这里,诗人采用对立情绪产生的矛盾效果,浪漫地表达了自己的情感,真可谓悠悠离愁,万种风情,一切尽在不言中。
  再如,英国桂冠诗人Alfred Tennyson(1809——1892)一句诗:
  His honour rooted in dishonour stood
  And faith unfaithful kept him falsely true.
  他那来源于不名誉的名誉依然如故,
  而那并不诚实的诚实保持虚伪的忠诚。
  在这句诗中,诗人巧妙运用dishonour修饰honour, unfaithful修饰faith, falsely修饰true,从而形成一系列的语义对立,产生出了鲜明的矛盾修辞效果。
  我国古典名著《红楼梦》(A Dream of Red Mansion)的英译堪称译界的一个典范。这里举一个成功运用矛盾修辞法的例子,就是英译者巧用much ado about nothing前后矛盾的语言特点,不仅使译文与原文的风格保持一致,而且使其产生出了生动活泼,诙谐讽刺与耐人寻味的效果。例如:
  “You’ve already got one,” Baochai chuckled, “Much Ado about Nothing is just the name for you.”
  宝钗笑道:“你的绰号早有了,‘无事忙’三个字恰当得很。”
  在此例中,much ado 和nothing的语义是相互矛盾的。译者正是巧用这一特点把对贾宝玉“终日瞎忙,无所事事”的讥讽传神地表现出来,具有画龙点睛之效果。
  上述三例均形象生动地表现出矛盾修辞丰富与深刻地意蕴。三例的修辞手法一样,但寓意各异,仔细品味,确实引人入胜,出神入化。
  上述妙笔之处均源自“文学语言”,然而矛盾修辞法的应用范围绝非仅限于此,它渗透到各种体裁的文章。就以《大学英语·精读》(修订本)为例,其课文经常出现矛盾修辞法。
  无独有偶,上述关于英译本《红楼梦》中much ado about nothing的例子在课本第二册第七课There’s Only Luck中也得到了运用。例如:
  They(The Police)were ill-tempered about what was, to them, much ado about nothing.
  对这件事在他们(警察)看来完全是小题大做的事,他们火气不小。
  这一含有矛盾修辞法的习语的语义对立形象地揭示了惊恐万分的邻居及无动于衷的警察之间的对立心里活动。与英译本《红楼梦》中much ado about nothing的运用相比较,两者可谓起到了“同曲异工”的效果,揭示了矛盾修辞法丰富与深刻的意蕴。

文章中说这句话“Our competitors are paying people quite well [and are] very willing to pay employees guaranteed bonuses of very high amounts.”使用了矛盾修辞法。

我有点不太理解,是说“paying people quite well”与“are very willing to pay”之间是矛盾的么?求指点!

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发表于 2009-12-25 17:38:54 |只看该作者
本帖最后由 番茄斗斗 于 2009-12-25 17:46 编辑

8# aladdin.ivy
"Our competitors are paying people quite well [and are]very willing to pay employees guaranteed bonuses of very high amounts."
我是这样理解哦,不知道是否欠妥:
首先Mr Viniar的基调是不认同这样的制度。这从后文的'Mr Viniar also showed that he has a very short memory, arguingthat Goldman is operating without any government guarantee, ignoringthe reality of the government guarantee that kept the system going justa year ago."可知

再看这里的competitor与pay quite well and willing to pay的语义截然(后者是肯定,前者自然是相对的)
我的理解是这里的competitor是假想的,即Mr Viniar调侃说他们的对手可能给了很多的compensastion和benefit,所以Goldman Sachs调高benefit是合理的。这讽刺了goldman sachs不顾公司核心投资的下降,调高benefit的不妥。
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发表于 2009-12-25 18:11:49 |只看该作者
Mr Kaplan argues that the most powerful criticism of executive pay-that bosses get upside and no downside-is simply false
Mr Kaplan's best chance of turning the voting around is to demonstrate that outstanding bosses can boost the performance of the organisations that they head
propped up 支持
As in any otherprivate firm, there are no agency costs to worry about and they can dowhatever they like




out of whack.不正常 紊乱
opportunity cost机会成本
gross-ups补偿费
Perquisites津贴
clamping down抑制
rank and file普通员工
oxymoron矛盾修辞法
uncoupled脱节脱离


My comments
Based on the debate above, the argument of Minow is strong and point out the weak point of Kaplan punctually. It is true that the quality of those lawers, consultants, and athlete are completely different, it is not necessary to compare their earns with CEOs’. Minow also point out some of the logic flaw in Kaplan’s statement. But I think the most important thing for them to do is to argue to the point and focus on whether CEOs are over paid, rather than those trivial deficits in the statement.

In my opinion. Following mesures can be applied to make excutive compensation system more proper.

First, laws need to be enact that the company is free to make up for losses in stock value with other grants of cashes and stocks only on the condition that the company must announce bankrupt when futher loses exceed a limit. The limit can be set to grantee that those investors can get certain part of the money back. Recently, the profit is too alluring make the risk seems not that much a problem. By doing so, the cost of failure will multiplied. Broad and CEOs will be more cautious when making investment decisions.

The golden parachute in compensation system need to be revised. The CEOs who was fired can go away with conpensation. But this money need to be fixed with ther performance and contribution to the company during their tenure. Several factors can be count when caculating their severance pay- the total profit the company gain, the period of the tenure, and the loses directly caused by CEO.
走别人的路,让别人无路可走

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发表于 2009-12-25 19:06:54 |只看该作者
本帖最后由 番茄斗斗 于 2009-12-25 19:08 编辑

好词-结构-表达-生词-难句

Rebuttal(反驳;抗辩) statements

The moderator's rebuttal remarks
Oct 23rd 2009 | Adrian Wooldridge  

It seems that experts are just as passionate on the subject of executive pay as the general public.
Mr Kaplan argues that the most powerful criticism of executive pay-thatbosses get upside and no downside-is simply false. He points out thatthree of the most maligned bosses in the financial services sector,Vikram Pandit of Citigroup, John Mack of Morgan Stanley and KennethLewis of Bank of America, all lost small fortunes in 2008. CEOs as agroup lost roughly 40% of their wealth in 2008.
Ms Minow argues that her rebuttal is being written by the headlines.Financial service companies are once again paying huge bonuses despitethe fact that their companies have been propped up by public money. Shepoints out that CEOs enjoy the unique privilege of being able toappoint the people who decide their pay. She also reiterates the pointthat there are plenty of devices such as golden parachutes that cannotpossibly be justified by performance.
In his expert evidence Rakesh Khurana tries to focus on fundamentalquestions such as what the purpose of compensation is. He argues thatthe market for CEOs is a highly distorted one because CEOs themselvescan influence the process and performance is hard to measure. Hesuggests that extreme pay differentials can damage companies byattracting the wrong sort of bosses and demotivating the rank and file(普通成员).He also worries about the legitimacy of the system. One survey suggeststhat only 13% of people trust what CEOs say.
So far the voting is going heavily against the motion. But I wonder howfar this is driven by emotion rather than a reasoned assessment of theevidence. I would urge the participants to pay close attention to thewording of the motion-particularly the key phrases 'one the whole' and'deserve'. We need to focus more on the overall picture, around theworld as well as in the United States, rather than on a fewattention-grabbing anecdotes. And we need to think more closely aboutthe word 'deserve'. Mr Kaplan's best chance of turning the votingaround is to demonstrate that outstanding bosses can boost theperformance of the organisations that they head(引导), not only earning theirpay but also benefitting workers, shareholders and consumers.


The proposer's rebuttal remarks
Oct 23rd 2009 | Steven N. Kaplan

Nell Minow argues that top executive compensation was a major cause ofthe financial crisis. She bases her conclusion on two "outlier"examples, Angelo Mozillo and Aubrey McClendon, that she calls"anecdotes". The plural of anecdote is data. And the data, that is thepay at a broad sample of financial companies, simply do not support herconclusion. Ironically, neither do her two anecdotes.
Ms Minow makes the following claims. (1) Incentive compensationrewarded top financial executives for the quantity of transactions, notthe quality. (2) Top CEOs, like Mr Mozillo, took large amounts of moneyout of their companies before their companies failed. (3) The CEOs knewthey were making bad investments, but did so anyway because they couldmake more money doing so. (4) CEOs get upside, but no downside. (5) Thepost-meltdown awards create incentives that reward management, butdamage shareholders and everyone else.
These claims are false. As David Yermack of NYU pointed out in a recentpiece in the Wall Street Journal, Vikram Pandit of Citigroup, John Mackof Morgan Stanley and Kenneth Lewis of Bank of America:
"all lost small fortunes in 2008. The 2008 compensation of MessrsPandit, Mack, and Lewis was approximately minus $105 million, minus $40million, and minus $108 million, respectively, after taking account ofthe losses on the stock that each CEO owned in his firm. Other CEOs inthe financial industry had similarly bad years. Kerry Killinger ofWashington Mutual lost more than $25 million before being ousted inSeptember, Kennedy Thompson of Wachovia lost more than $30 millionbefore being fired in June, and Jeffrey Immelt of General Electric lostmore than $60 million ... These CEOs' financial reversals(a change (as of fortune) often for the worse) were part ofa robust system of pay-for-performance widely used by most U.S.companies."
Yermack also points out that James Cayne lost most of hisbillion-dollar fortune when Bear Stearns failed and Richard Fuld ofLehman Brothers lost hundreds of millions of dollars.
The fact is that most financial-company CEOs received the lion's shareof their pay in stock and options. And they kept most of that pay asshares in their companies which they never cashed in. When the crisishit and their stock prices sank, those CEOs lost a large fraction oftheir wealth and, in many cases, their jobs.
As I wrote in my first entry, this is true, in general, of the overallCEO market. CEOs earn a lot and their stock appreciates when theircompanies perform well. CEOs lose large amounts of wealth and theirjobs when their companies perform poorly. It is irresponsible to claimthat CEOs do not bear any downside risk. In 2008, CEOs as a group lostroughly 40% of their wealth.
In direct contradiction to Ms Minow's conclusion, the financial CEOswere compensated in the end for the quality of their transactions. TheCEOs did not take much off the table. The CEOs had a substantial amountof downside risk. In fact, those CEOs would have been much better offif they had not engaged in the transactions they did.
It is worth adding that David Yermack is a noted researcher on CEO paywho studies large samples over long periods. He has written severalarticles highly critical of specific CEO pay practices, like corporatejet usage. Nevertheless, his conclusion on the relation of CEO pay tothe financial crisis is diametrically opposed to Ms Minow's (as is hischaracterisation of the CEO market in general).
A study of CEO incentives in a broader group of financial institutionsduring the crisis by Rudi Fahlenbrach and Rene Stulz of Ohio State (anda former president of the American Finance Association) confirmsYermack's analysis and also clearly refutes Ms Minow's conclusion.
Ironically, even her two anecdotes about Angelo Mozillo of Countrywideand Aubrey McClendon of Chesapeake Energy fail to support her case.
Unlike the other CEOs mentioned above (and most financial-institutionCEOs), Mr Mozillo did manage to sell a lot of his stock. Unfortunatelyfor him, the SEC has charged him with securities fraud and insidertrading. And it is unlikely to lead to a good outcome for him. If foundguilty, he potentially will end up paying three times what he took out.Clearly, he appears to have behaved badly, but he did not get away withit.
As for Mr McClendon, he runs an energy company. How could he possibly have had anything to do with the financial crisis?
The preponderance of the data and, even Ms Minow's "outlier""anecdotes," therefore, fail to provide any evidence that top executivecompensation had much to do with the financial crisis.
Top executive compensation did not cause the financial crisis. Instead,the crisis was caused by loose monetary policy, a global capital glut,over-high leverage (影响力)at investment banks, mandates from Congress toprovide mortgages to people who could not afford them, flawed ratingsfrom the rating agencies and poor incentives at mortgage origination(not the CEO) level. Consistent with this, the financial crisis hasspread to financial institutions in other countries with very differentpay practices.(这一段解释了经济危机的起源,值得参考~~)


The opposition's rebuttal remarks
Oct 23rd 2009 |  Nell Minow

The headlines are writing my rebuttal for me.
Goldman Sachs set aside $16.7 billion for compensation and benefits inthe first nine months of 2009, up 46% from a year ago. While its netincome has tripled, its core investment banking business is down 31%.The Toronto Star quotes Goldman'sCFO, David Viniar, using an unforgivable oxymoron(矛盾修辞法) in a conference callwith reporters: "Our competitors are paying people quite well [and are]very willing to pay employees guaranteed bonuses of very high amounts." (emphasis added)
Mr Viniar also showed that he has a very short memory, arguingthat Goldman is operating without any government guarantee, ignoringthe reality of the government guarantee that kept the system going justa year ago.
These bonuses have nothing to do with paying for performance. How muchof Goldman's bouncing back is due to the government's guarantees and thehundreds of billions of dollars it poured into Goldman, Wall Street, andother subsidies and outright welfare payments to the very institutionsthat came close to bringing down the entire economy? Shouldn't theAmerican people expect some sort of discounted calculation of thebonuses that reflect a market-based assessment of performance? Onceagain, Wall Street is all about capitalism when it comes to the upside,but all about socialism when itcomes to the downside, that is, fromeach, according to his ability, to each, whatever he can get away with.
Also this week, we had the testimony of Neil Barofsky, the specialinspector general for the government's financial rescue programme beforethe House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform. The serialoffender AIG has promised$198m in bonus pay to its employees nextMarch, according to the testimony, and there is very little thegovernment or anyone else can do about it. Because the bonus agreementswere entered into before the bailout, the government has no legalauthority to stop them. All Special Master Kenneth Feinberg can do isask the company not to pay the bonuses and rattle his sabre(炫耀武力,吓唬) about thepay he can control going forward, hoping that the threat of clampingdown on(强加) the 25 executives at each of the covered companies he does haveauthority over will be enough of an incentive to force a change. In themeantime, once again,pay is uncoupled from performance. Even thecompany has given up on trying to make that case, relying instead onopportunity costs to justify the bonuses and arguing that these kinds ofpayments are necessary in order to keep the employees from leaving.Based on their past performance and their unwillingness to tie futurepay to genuine measures of sustainable growth, I suggest that the bestchoice for shareholders is to let them  leave.
Mr Barofksy gave the committee a Treasury Department report on the lastset of outrageous AIG bonuses. It concluded in part that "Treasuryinvested $40 billionof taxpayer funds in AIG, designed AIG'scontractual executivecompensation restrictions, and helped manage theGovernment's majoritystake in AIG for several months, all withouthaving any detailed information about the scope of AIG's verysubstantial, and verycontroversial, executive compensationobligations." If a private entity had been asked for emergency funds, itis unthinkable that any money would have been advanced withoutestablishing some control overcompensation. There are two reasons forthis. The first is agency costs. Anyone (other than Secretary HenryPaulson, apparently) putting money at risk will want to ensure that itwill not be inappropriately appropriated. The second is the highlikelihood that the previous incentive structure was a significantfactor in the bad decisions and catastrophic risk management thatcreated the need for the funds in thefirst place.
And really, that is all the argument one needs. By definition, theincentive compensation was badly designed, as proved bythe results.However, I will respond to some of the points raised by Professor Kaplan.
First, we disagree on the calculations that support the conclusion thatCEO play has been declining. Our figures,based not on theoretical paybut on realised pay, are as follows.


Clearly actual pay is the better measure of pay effectiveness. I alsoquestion the validity of the Equilar survey figures. They are based onthe reported total compensation in the summary compensationtable, whichis even further from reality than the "expected pay", as it is just anaccounting cost.
I do not understand why he brings up the net worth of CEOs; that has norelationship whatsoever to their pay, its relationship to performance,or its effectiveness at aligning CEOs' interests with shareholders'.
Second, ProfessorKaplan states, "The typical CEO is paid forperformance. Board sincreasingly fire CEOs for poor performance." Thesecond sentence has no relationship to the first. Boards may fire CEOsfor poor performance, but they pay them boatloads of money for thatperformanceon the way out of the door. Just look at Ken Lewis'sdeparture fromBank of America. Disastrous performance that apparentlyincluded lying(about what else? bonuses) and an unprecedented vote ofno confidence from shareholders that removed him as chairman, may indeedhave caused him to be fired (though the board did not use that term).But his $53mretirement package does not feel like pay for performanceto me.
ProfessorKaplan tries to obscure the point by bringing in law firmpartners,athletes and other highly-paid professionals. Partners in lawfirms are paid according to formulas set by the partnership. As in anyother private firm, there are no agency costs to worry about and theycan do whatever they like. Athletes, movie stars and recording artists,whohave a much greater range and far greater elasticity incompensation,engage in vigorous arm's length negotiations on pay; theirpay is notset by boards they appoint, as CEOs' is.
And it is hard for me to understand how anyone could point to the US orUK government authorising excessive pay as a validation of the system.As noted above, the government has repeatedly failed as regulator or asproviderof capital in curbing outrageously destructive executivecompensation.
Here are seven deadly sins found in executive compensation plans.Eachof them is conclusive evidence that the system is out of whack(运行不正常).
1.    Making up for losses in stock value with other grants of cash or stock.
2.    Imputed years of service to increase retirement benefits.
3.    Setting the performance goals too low or other phony metrics to trigger bonuses.
4.    Dividends on unvested stock.
5.    Outrageous departure packages.
6.    Stock options that are not performance-based or indexed.
7.    Perquisites and gross-ups.

In my next response, I will explain how to do it right.

--------------
扫盲区:
1.golden parachute:A golden parachute is an agreement between a company and anemployee (usually upper executive) specifying that the employee willreceive certain significant benefits if employment is terminated.Sometimes, certain conditions, typically a change in company ownership,must be met, but often the cause of termination is unspecified. Thesebenefits may include severance pay, cash bonuses, stock options, or other benefits. They are designed to reduce perverse incentives—paradoxically (and ironically) they may create them.

2.oxymoron:矛盾修饰法
A rhetorical figure in which incongruous or contradictory terms arecombined, as in a deafening silence and a mournful optimist.
  矛盾修饰法:一种把互相矛盾或不调和的词合在一起的修辞手法,如在震耳欲聋的沉默 和 悲伤的乐观
  所谓矛盾修辞法(Oxymoron)是指将语义截然相反对立的词语放在一起使用,来揭示某一项事物矛盾性质的一种修辞手法。换言之,它使用两种不相协调,甚至截然相反的特征来形容一项事物,以增强语言感染力。在阅读理解解码过程中,矛盾修辞法可以产生出两种强烈的修辞效果。第一,出人意料。由于两部分语义相互矛盾,合并使用有悖常理,所以矛盾修辞强烈碰撞读者的神经思维,起到意想不到,启发思维的作用,为进一步深化理解奠定了基础。例如英语的cruelkindness,汉语的“真实的谎言”和“甜美的复仇”便是矛盾修辞法的具体表现。读到上述那样的矛盾词语组合读者肯定会有出乎意料的感觉。第二,引人入胜。矛盾词语的冲击会激发读者进一步深化理解的欲望。在仔细推敲这种看似矛盾的语言表达之后,读者会发现矛盾修辞法所表示的语义矛盾不仅符合逻辑,而且使文章更加形象生动,意蕴丰富且深刻。

回到文章的这句话:"Our competitors are paying people quite well [and are]very willing to pay employees guaranteed bonuses of very high amounts."

首先Mr Viniar的基调是不认同这样的制度。这从后文的'Mr Viniar also showed that he has a veryshort memory, arguingthat Goldman is operating without any governmentguarantee, ignoringthe reality of the government guarantee that keptthe system going justa year ago."可知
再看这里的competitor与pay quite well and willing to pay的语义截然(后者是肯定,前者自然是相对的)
我的理解是这里的competitor是假想的,即MrViniar调侃说他们的对手可能给了很多的compensastion和benefit,所以GoldmanSachs调高benefit是合理的。这讽刺了goldman sachs不顾公司核心投资的下降,调高benefit的不妥。

3.Wall Street is all about capitalism when it comes to the upside,but all about socialism when itcomes to the downside, that is, fromeach, according to his ability, to each, whatever he can get away with.
这句话有点难理解,联系金融危机以来美国政府将大多数企业国有化,难道是说华尔街在繁华时期施行资本主义,低谷时期施行社会主义?还望经济小牛来解释下~~
没有找到相关的材料,不过看到篇很有意思的文章,链接如下:
美国救市是拯救还是摧毁资本主义        



-----------------
COMMENT:
The proposer and opposition above present us a fierce and excellent argument, as both of them pinpoint the weakness of the statement given from the other side.

According to Kalpan,the performances of the CEO win them various benefit and most of them are stocks,whose profit is close related to the situation of the company. As he illustrates by cases, the myth none-performance-related paying system is busted. In addition, Mr Kalpan question on Nilnow's knowledge about the economic crisis, which is rather linked to the monenary system.

However, Ms Nilnow is more likely to focus on the cases in the contex of the economic crisis. With all shared character, the increasing compensation and lowing income or invement of the quoted companys bring us a tremendous shock. What's more, as she put it, theoretical pay,rather than relised pay, is ridiculous. If this is the case, it's irresponsible to conclude whether the pay has risen or not.


Strong as them claim, flaws are inevitable as well. Ms Nilnow emphasises too much on the current context, while Kalpan is making it obsolutedly right to have the huge exercutive pay. As the debate more likely appear with the advent of the economic crisis and with the arguable leavinig pay, we are obscuring the idea of an CEO. And this in turn brings us into extreme knowledge about it. CEO is taking a great responsibility of a company, as this is for sure, a great exposure is following along with his works. He's being examed every minute and every time, menwhile, his tenure is determined by the stock marcket. Even though there's no comparison between CEO and other professional, we see there's a similarity-talent decides the pay. If one is well-paid, his ability must be appreciated.

看晕掉了。。。COMMENT就到这儿吧
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pluka + 1 good job!

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发表于 2009-12-25 19:20:39 |只看该作者
10# dingyi0311

犀利丁的COMMENT~

My comments
Basedon the debate above, the argument of Minow is strong and points out theweak point of Kaplan's punctually. It is true that the quality of thoselawers, consultants, and athlete are completely different, it is notnecessary to compare their earns with CEOs’. Minow also points out someof the logic flaws in Kaplan’s statement. But I think the most importantthing for them to do is to argue to the point and focus(这里的S要去掉的吧~) on whether CEOsare over paid, rather than those trivial deficits in the statement.

In my opinion. Following mesures can be applied to make excutive compensation system more proper.

First,laws need to be enacted that the company is free to make up for losses instock value with other grants of cashes and stocks only on thecondition that the company must announce bankrupt when futher losesexceed a(the?) limit. The limit can be set to grantee(guarante?) that those investorscan get certain part of the money back. Recently, the profit is tooalluring make the risk seems not that much a problem(动词好多。。。建议:the alluring profit seems to reduce  the risk 。). By doing so, thecost of failure will multiplied. Broad and CEOs will be more cautiouswhen making investment decisions.

Thegolden parachute in compensation system needs to be revised. The CEOswho was fired can go away with conpensation. But this money needs to befixed with ther performance and contribution(contributed?) to the company duringtheir tenure. Several factors can be counted when caculating theirseverance pay- the total profit the company gain, the period of thetenure, and the loses(losses) directly caused by CEO.

丁丁同学,动词单复数都不太注意哦,以后写好COMMENT 要留个几分钟检查下~~还有,貌似被动用好多。。记得在第一次作业的语法上看到说,对于议论性的文章,要更多的用主动,尤其不强调动作时~~
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dingyi0311 + 1 非常感谢

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发表于 2009-12-25 19:47:46 |只看该作者
It seems that there is another follow-up debates after this rebuttal statements waiting for us to read, as the author claim that “in my response, I will explain how to do it right”.

Since I am not a professional specialist of financial crisis and executive pay and have little background knowledge in this field, I just want to comment this article in my view, that is, in a general reader’s view. There are two flaws in this statement I want to point out. First, the argument’s topic is “This house believes that on the whole, senior executives are worth what they are paid”. We should pay close attention to the key phrases “on the whole” and”worth” of the motion. As both of the key phrases are abstractive phrases and every reader holds a different perception on them, authors should debate after definiting the meaning of them. Second, both arguers use many examples which are focus on specific person hence, to some extent, not with a huge amount of sample to refute opposite arguer’s views, these examples are not under a “on the whole” situation.

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发表于 2009-12-25 21:19:14 |只看该作者
本帖最后由 rodgood 于 2009-12-26 01:49 编辑

Useful words and expressions:

maligned诽谤
been propped up by
appoint任命
golden parachutes降落伞
extreme pay differentials极端的薪水差额
glut充斥
leverage杠杆影响
mandate批准
outright彻底的 welfare payments
conclusive evidence决定性的证据
out of whack重击


She bases her conclusion on two "outlier" examples.

It is irresponsible to claim that CEOs do not bear any downside risk.

In direct contradiction to Ms Minow's conclusion,…

The CEOs did not take much off the table. The CEOs had a substantial amount of downside risk.

Ironically, even her two anecdotes about Angelo Mozillo of Countrywide and Aubrey McClendon of Chesapeake Energy fail to support her case.

Once again, Wall Street is all about capitalism when it comes to the upside, but all about socialism when it comes to the downside, that is, from each, according to his ability, to each, whatever he can get away with.



Based on their past performance and their unwillingness to tie future pay to genuine measures of sustainable growth, I suggest that the best choice for shareholders is to let them leave.
好幽默


CEOs earn a lot and their stock appreciatesvi.增值,vt.赏识) when their companies perform well.

If found guilty, he potentially will end up paying three times what he took out.

Shouldn't the American people expect some sort of discounted calculation of the bonuses that reflect a market-based assessment of performance?


Ironically, even her two anecdotes about Angelo Mozillo of Countrywide and Aubrey McClendon of Chesapeake Energy fail to support her case.
哈,这里精彩了,以子之矛攻子之盾。因为上篇文章中opposition举了这两个anecdotes来证明CEO的糟糕表现damages the credits of Wall Street...balabala
As for Mr McClendon, he runs an energy company. How could he possibly have had anything to do with the financial crisis?
Mr McClendon 经营的是能源公司,他又怎么会和经济危机有关呢?说的好,所谓釜底抽薪。
The preponderance of the data and, even Ms Minow's "outlier" "anecdotes," therefore, fail to provide any evidence that top executive compensation had much to do with the financial crisis.
总结呼应前面的ironically

"The typical CEO is paid for performance. Boards increasingly fire CEOs for poor performance." The second sentence has no relationship to the first. 仔细一想,的确如此。真是佩服犀利的眼光。



My comments:

In proposer's rebuttal remarks, opposition's claims in the debate yesterday are refuted in details. Firstly, some examples of CEO who suffered losses before been fired are presented to prove the existence of pay-for-performance system. (Unfortunately, this becomes a point that the opposition attacks later on.) Then proposer states that with the fact that CEO pay rises with corporation's upside risk, CEOs also undertake downside risks. Furthermore, the anecdotes mentioned by the opposition in the last round of debate as evidence to prove damage to the credits of American economy from bad performance of certain CEOs are reversely become swords towards the opposition. Finally, the proposer restates the viewpoint that there is no combination between executive compensation and the financial crisis.

The opposition focus the rebuttal on the poor existence of incentive compensation. At the beginning, the example of AGI is used to argue that incentive compensation is useless and may cause bad influence. Then the rebuttal begins with disagreement on the accuracy of the data offered by proposer in the last round. Additionally, the relationship between pay-for-performance and firing-for-performance is substantially and perfectly denied. The comparison of CEO to other high paid groups and government authorizing to incentive compensation are also disproved. Seven deadly sins found in executive compensation plans are listed.


知识背景:
1.She also reiterates the point that there are plenty of devices such as golden parachutes降落伞 that cannot possibly be justified by performance.

金色降落伞概述   金色降落伞(Golden Parachute,又译黄金降落伞),是按照聘用合同中公司控制权变动条款对高层管理人员进行补偿的规定,最早产生在美国。“金色”意指补偿丰厚,“降落伞”意指高管可规避公司控制权变动带来的冲击而实现平稳过渡。这种让收购者“大出血”的策略,属于反收购的“毒丸计划”之一。其原理可扩大适用到经营者各种原因的退职补偿。
  金色降落伞规定在目标公司被收购的情况下,公司高层管理人员无论是主动还是被迫离开公司,都可以得到一笔巨额安置补偿费用,金额高的会达到数千万甚至数亿美元,因此使收购方的收购成本增加,成为抵御恶意收购的一种防御措施。但其弊端是,巨额补偿有可能诱导管理层低价出售企业。
  http://wiki.mbalib.com/wiki/%E9%87%91%E8%89%B2%E9%99%8D%E8%90%BD%E4%BC%9E

2.David Viniar used an unforgivable oxymoron矛盾修饰法 in a conference call with reporters: "Our competitors are paying people quite well [and are] very willing to pay employees guaranteed bonuses of very high amounts." (emphasis added)

An oxymoron (plural oxymora (Greek plural) or, more often, oxymorons) ("sharply dull" in Greek) is a figure of speech that combines normally contradictory terms. They appear in a range of contexts, from inadvertent errors such as extremely average, to deliberate puns like same difference, to literary oxymorons that have been carefully crafted to reveal a paradox.

The most common form of oxymoron involves an adjective-noun combination. For example, the following line from Tennyson's Idylls of the King contains two oxymora:


"And faith unfaithful kept him falsely true."


Less often seen is noun-verb combinations such as the line


"The silence whistles"


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxymoron

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发表于 2009-12-25 22:37:10 |只看该作者
NOTE
rank and file:基层,普通成员,士兵。
wording:措辞。
a few attention-grabbing anecdotes:引人注意的轶闻。
diametrically:直接地。
leverage:杠杆作用。经济学中指由于一项经济活动引起的一个经济指标很小的变动从而使另一个经济指标有较大的变动的现象。比如财务杠杆作用是由于债务存在而导致普通股股东权益大于息税前利润变动的杠杆效应。
oxymoron:矛盾修饰法。pay is uncoupled from performance.
boatloads of money(boatload:船的载货量,一条船的货物) 

the system is out of whack(重打、击败)。


SUMMARY

Stating that the plural of anecdote was data, Mr K rebuted Ms M's claims by firstly, again, turning to general data and reseaches. He cited Mr Yermack's recent article that CEOs as a whole lost fortunes in 2008, including those bad performers. CEOs, as Mr K explained, received a large proportion of their pay in stock and options instead of money, which made them bear a downside risk when crisis came. If the company lost money, so would the CEO. It seemed that Mr K mentioned those citations as long and general studies  particularly in order to contrast Ms M's certain anecdotes. And it worked.

Then, he refuted Ms M's claim on untied payment with performance as false, saying that financial CEOs were compensated for the quaility of their transactions but not, as Ms M suggested, for the quantity.Once more general studies were refered to.

What put the argument more compelling was Mr K's skillful penetration that veered Ms M's attractive examples into counterexamples. Angelo Mozillo, though gained unfair share as Ms M attacked before, faced the legal charge and dim future. Mr McClendon, criticized by Ms M as one of the crisis causer, ran an energy company that has nothing to do with the financial crunch. 

Ended by providing alternative reasons for economic crisis, Mr K convincingly proved that CEOs did have lost fortune and did not have caused crisis.

Ms M started defending her claim on the company's disguise of current run and pay as well as the governmental inability of curbing outrageous CEOs' compensation by recent news and testimony from cooperation and government respectively. She confirmed once again that the incentive compensation was badly designed.

After that, Ms M responded several points of Mr K. The first was on the calculation of payment.The second was related to compensation-performance tie(the outrageous retirement package for bad performers could hardly be justified). The third was about the comparison of payment among CEOs and other professionals(other vocations received bonus from arm's length system but CEOs decided the pay for themselves indirectly).

She ended up with seven sins in executive compensation plans.

COMMENT

For me, this debate is an interesting one yet without clear-cut. The significant point is, as Mr K maintained, whether the performance deserves the reward. I thought that question before, puzzled by the wild difference on salary between the CEO and other personnel,say, an engineer. Though Mr K offered evidences that CEOs have lost a lot by now, one may still wonder if the baseline for their payment has been badly designed from the initial and thus the downsize may prove no abnormal lost but a just return.Ms M's contention that CEOs could actually govern their own income hits me. If that is true(I'm not familiar to economy and cannot judge it), healthier, stronger and more independent compensation system is surely necessary. 
Oh I don't know what to comment~~~though intriguing, it's still a hard topic for me to delve...
横行不霸道~

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