美国著名商学院 MBA Candidate 闲聊系列之二：University of Michigan (Ross)

kevinhrmUID: 2158364

以下内容，转自 http://learning.sohu.com/17/19/article208511917.shtml ，已经过整理

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* U( j7 B, A9 J- S& h& E据《美国新闻杂志2000年》报导，密歇根大学（University of Michigan）不仅是美国中西部10大名校中排名第一的大学，也是美国名列前茅的公立大学。总部设于Ann Arbor，学生总数有3万7千人；位于Dearborn及Flint的分校则共有1万5千名学生。每学期共开办5600种学士及研究学位的科目，课程选择富有弹性。

) T1 B, k; w( R! J" x/ l5 ]7 G自1817年建校以来，密歇根大学有校友超过40万人，拥有全美最大规模的校友会组织。美国始终名列前茅的常春藤大学之一，设有19个学院，各学院的学术水平排名领先群雄，其中商学院、人力资源院、社会工作院、社会心理学院、人类学院等更是一枝独秀。大学排名全国前10名的研究院课程有商业、工程、医学、护理、法律、公共事务、心理学、社会学和历史，多位教授及校友在医学、化学、经济学、新闻学、文学等等方面，获颁诺贝尔奖及普立策新闻奖。密歇根大学还是全美中国学研究重镇，其亚洲藏书馆的藏书可与哈佛的燕京图书馆相媲美，美国现任驻华大使、克林顿总统的白宫中国事务顾问等均师出该校。钱其琛之子钱宁在该校留学期间著有风行全国的《留学美国》，书中对该校有详尽描述。

4 b5 C, m4 K) N, D( G南非前总统曼德拉、美国前第一夫人希拉丽、老布什总统及其夫人、前印尼总统苏加诺、前菲律宾总统马可斯、前墨西哥总统卡洛斯、台湾蒋宋美龄女士，以及有美国“汽车大王”之名的亨利福特等许多国际知名的政经领袖，均曾获密歇根大学颁发名誉学位。

密歇根大学共设有14个开放给学生及教职员使用的电脑中心，其中许多电脑中心是全天候24小时开放的。大学在每个宿舍也另外设有电脑中心，方便学生使用。
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密歇根大学设有近千个学生社团及组织，各种性质的活动，应有尽有。另外大学博物馆、艺术中心、公园等等也是学生课余休闲的好去处，大学生活多姿多彩。

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罗斯（Ross）商学院近年来所获殊荣：
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• 500 名学生以上规模商学院MBA专业排名第一 - The Wall Street Journal，2002年
4 R$ r3 k$ O; f5 S5 k4 q3 o! u• 在“最佳商学院报告”中是唯一在所有五项学科类别都排前五名的商学院：金融技能、营销技能、全球视野、技术和综合管理 - Business Week，2002年10月
• 在The Wall Street Journal/Harris Interactive Survey 中最常被公司招聘人员提名为要雇用少数族裔的最佳商学院 - The Wall Street Journal，2002年
• 最常被公司招聘人员提名要雇用女性的最佳商学院排名第五 - The Wall Street Journal，2002年
( b- g# Z' q4 n: j- P5 ~• BBA专业排名第三 - U.S. News and World Report, 2002年
• 高级管理人员教育世界顶尖排名之一，人力资源项目排名第一，综合管理项目排名第二 - Business Week, 2001年
4 ?: J0 ?- K5 D. y7 M• 研究成果排名第二 - Academy of Management Journal，2000年
: _9 k5 T% p$ ^- z8 B/ K• 最有创新意识的商学院 - Business Week, 1999年10月
/ K; v- B) t+ W7 j9 g) ]: m• 最适合女性的学校排名第二 - Working Woman，1998年　　
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[ 本帖最后由 kevinhrm 于 2006-7-10 15:52 编辑 ]

kevinhrmUID: 2158364

以下全部对话内容，均转自 forum.chasedream.com，已经过整理

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1 b) ~8 S: v9 _3 \  A有几个问题请教一下：
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Ross是否可以申请无担保的贷款？最大贷款额？
贷款是否可以作为签证时候的资金证明？
- a4 d) [* _4 W+ {7 U3 W: [签证的资金需要冻结多少时间？

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Yes, you can apply for the CitiAssist loan - no co-signer needed, no guarantee fee. You get 100% of the amount you apply for. Loan amount covers tuition plus living expenses, whatever that number is on your I-20.

You loan can be used as a financial source for I-20 purposes, but I'd advise to use your personal/family funding as much as possible for visa application.
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I agree with what redsoxfan said above, and add that only several top 10 b-school admits are eligible for CitiAssist Loan which is the best option for international MBA students. The only thing I am not sure is whether the loan can be used as a financial source for I-20 purpose, since at the time issuing I-20, the loan has not been approved until early September.
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最大贷款额？－－－－$56,000 per year.

1 \$ Z3 S2 y$ L9 G签证的资金需要冻结多少时间？－－－－－It does not matter. After you get visa, return the financial certificate to the bank, and your money will be unfrozen. The visa officer will not keep your financial certificate. What matters is the saving history on your bank book; longer history, better luck. The best practice is to put money on your saving book as early as possible. Do not wait till last minute.

kevinhrmUID: 2158364

在ROSS，F2能旁听MBA课程吗？在这方面有什么限制吗？如果先F2，然后在ROSS旁听，接着申请今年的第一轮，是不是机会比在国内稍微大一点点呢？
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- h+ R& C, W* H* Z* o, q; SYes, F2 can audit classes as long as the classroom is not full and professors do not object.

5 U. G8 H7 w/ ]: b9 XThe advantages for F2 who is going to apply F1 in Ross are:

( c' s: K: _# G$ N1 O1. Know more about Ross
* _0 i9 ~8 Y" I. c7 r2 J2. Meet with current Ross students and admission officers
5 k; m% p( Z7 p4 I" ^5 _0 B3. Attend all kinds of events (career, social, fun, etc) in Ross
  u. B- G# q: ]+ |6 u8 f" h4. Understand more about career path and job opportunities for MBAs

5 J- c6 ]: r+ s9 h9 e/ u' H3 ?+ _& wThe disadvantages could be:

1. Break the job continuation
0 s0 F# r7 j! F2 U2 {2. Lose one year salary
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/ f' T. e; g0 U# @1 c! kIn fact, there are successful stories (F2==>F1) in 07 admits, and I will connect you with them via 08 admits forum, which has been already established, pending for the complete admission list from admission officers.
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什么时候开始申请助学贷款呢？是接到正式录取通知的文件之后就开始，还是要等到开学前到学校以后呢？
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6 {' k1 D: Q0 ^# Lwithin one month after the fall semester starts, sometime before end of Sep.

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3 N4 Y; ?2 [/ ]今天收到admit binder，但是要偶参加6月27日至8月11日的英语program.实在不是偶觉得自己英语有多么好 就是觉得偶每天8小时工作至少6个小时在跟鬼子说英语 还需要花那么长时间去读这个program吗？有没有办法跟学校说明情况 免除这个program啊？
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如果师兄师姐上过这个program后 的确觉得很有收获 极力推荐小妹参加 小妹肯定参加
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It depends on your language proficiency. The problem is that even if you use English eveyday at work in China, you still need time to adapt to the real English speaking environment. Spending two and half months ahead to get you well prepared will help you to stay in better shape when academic studies, recruiting events and social activities overwhelm you right after the beginning of fall term.
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Most of the first year Chinese students who took the program last year found it quite fruitful. The program integrates business case study, group discussion, writing and presentation, which is really practical and directly applicable to MBA studies. Furthermore, you can start networking with other international students earlier, which is another selling point of the program. However, the program is pretty demanding with intense meeting schedule and heavy work load. So be prepared for that if you decide to enroll.
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6 f8 {; I/ ]+ M) rYou should also take into consideration the problems of residence and shopping during the summer. You should plan early to settle your summer residence. Since you will not have a car in short time and most of the Chinese students will be out of town for their internship, shopping will become inconvenient for you.

1 Z/ ^2 c/ P" ]/ V" ?, C9 pBut those are trivia that all new comers probably will be faced. A number of Chinese students may sublease their apartment during the summer. Other than that, I think the Great Chinese Association will provide as much support as possible.

Congratulations and enjoy your summer!

kevinhrmUID: 2158364

师兄师姐们，请问Ross的天气如何呢？还有在Ross看病是什么样子的？费用何如？如果家属看病呢？
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Winter is pretty cold with heavy snows. But it adds flavors to Thanksgiving, Christmas and even the Spring Festival. Personally, I like snow, so my comments might be biased.

As for healthcare, the University of Michigan offers one of the most decent medical systems in the States. Most international students and their family are required to enrolled in the health insurance plan, which cover almost all kinds of diseases (as far as I remember, allergies and dentistry are not covered).

The normal procedure is: first go to the University Health Service (UHS) located on Central Campus for preliminary diagnosis (for family members, I remember it is somewhere on North Campus). If they can't treat, they will refer you to the University Hospital. In this way, you will not be charged co-payment. Of course in case of emergency, you should directly go to the University Hospital despite the co-payment. It is pretty much like Chinese universities. The difference is that better facilities and services are provided even at the University Health Service (UHS).
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7 p) y1 }5 [+ ?% m6 T/ XThat's all that I can remember. Hope it's helpful. The International Center will offer workshop on details of health insurance and the University medical system after your check-in.


2 ?" @' R0 s6 U  r  Z; R: \1. Binder 上说Ann Arbor有100多个托儿所，想带着小孩一起去，不知道师兄师弟可否帮助了解一下类似情况的在校同学觉得幼儿园怎么样？情况特殊，多谢了！
/ ~0 i2 [7 i3 ^2. 如果租Family House 也有每月700刀的吗？离学校远吗？可否乘公交车到达？不想马上买车，能省就省点！
3. 贷款需要Visa,而Visa需要财务证明，这是不是矛盾啊？
; e, v1 e: Q$ J, d- [' Z7 j4. 发I-20需要Financial resource statement, 什么样的材料是financial resourcing materials 啊？
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Question 1:

As far as I know, no Chinese students have their kids in local kindergarten (either too young or not in the States). Some of my Korean friends do and never heard them complaining about kindergarten here. I will try to get some more information for you.
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Question 2:

Check out the website: http://www.housing.umich.edu/northwood/index.html. all the family housing are called Northwood located north to North Campus (That's why it's best choice for the Chinese students of the Engineering School on North Campus). As far as I know, Northwoord I and III currently are accomodating undergraduates while Northwood II, IV and V are offered only to graduate students. Among them, Northwood II is a little bit older with smaller rooms while rooms in Northwood IV and V are much newer and spacious. Therefore, generally speaking Northwood II is much cheaper. Besides, the rental also differ between furnished and unfurnished. The rental includes all utilities, fixed line and DSL except for TV cable, which has additional monthly charge if installed.

0 s, X3 ]/ Q$ L% iAnn Arbor has one of the best public transportation systems in the States. Apart from TheRide, the local bus routes, the University has a number of self operated Blue Bus routes. Check out the website: http://www.transportation.umich. ... outes/index_fw.html The routes of Northwood and Northwood Express connect all the Northwoods and Central Campus during weekdays while the route of North Campus fulfills the role during weekends. It takes 10~15 minutes to get to Central Campus in weekdays and about 20 minutes in weekends. 3~5 minutes' walk is enough from the bus stop on Central Campus to the bschool. Personally, I find it quite convenient. Besides, Northwood IV is in walking distance to the supermarket and Chinese store on the Plymouth Rd. It's common to see people using the supermarket carts to tranport groceries back home. Hehe.

' k  M3 z1 o$ vAs properties of the University, Northwoods offer really nice choices to students.

Question 3:
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As far as I remember, you can settle you loan by filling out the form of Citibank and faxing/mailing it back with your acceptance letter. The admission assistant will contact the International Center to get your I-20 done. I think no visa information required.
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Question 4:

- {( R3 p! y+ p; q" ?Commonly accepted financial resource material is bank deposit certificate. I think banks in China require certain frozen period on the deposit to issue a bank deposit certificate. I recommend you to ask for at least two official copies of the certificate, one to be filed at the International Center for issuing I-20, one to be used during the visa interview. Not sure about other acceptable materials. You can take a look at the Visa section of Chasedream.com or Fudan BBS. You will get better answers.

kevinhrmUID: 2158364

我想问问citiassist的贷款是从什么时候还是计息？从我贷款开始？还是从我毕业开始？还是从我找到第一份工作开始？贷款除了要还利息外，还有什么pros&cons吗？

The interests will be incurred immediately after you borrow the loan, but you don't need pay it until sometime after you graduate. About the pros and cons, I think it's a little complex. You need to think about interest rate, currency conversion ratio and trend, how much you have, how risk-averse you are, etc. I heard somebody even invest into the stock with the borrowed money. If you can't figure all these out, my suggestion is, just borrow as needed.


+ `! I6 N" Z7 F# m6 M4 f0 {' C8 T今天收到admit binder，但是要偶参加6月27日至8月11日的英语program.实在不是偶觉得自己英语有多么好 就是觉得偶每天8小时工作至少6个小时在跟鬼子说英语 还需要花那么长时间去读这个program吗？有没有办法跟学校说明情况 免除这个program啊？

( [# C4 j$ U5 h$ Y* x" K2 I# Z0 [0 DJust a supplement to what Lxlr said.

5 T7 t" O( X0 J4 G+ i5 IMany class 07 students attended this program, but most of class 06 students who were required to attend didn't actually take it. I was one of them, but it was mainly because I don't want to spend all the money (fee, rent, etc) which can be up to a few thousand dollars.

So I have no idea on whether it's worthwhile or not, but I can tell you that it's very painful experience if you can't catch up with the class speed.
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& W7 n7 y& R: {8 O: {& l2 vIf you don't want to attend it, just give them some reasons, like you can't get the visa in time, you have convincingly good english, you can't leave your current work in time etc.

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7 M( v# s2 C$ j是不是说我必须带一年的学费过去先。不能用银行的贷款付学费，要先用自己的前垫付学费？
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No, you do not have to use your own money to pay the tuition. Your loan will cover that, and usually you will get the loan in early Sep. You only need to bring some money to cover the expense occured before your loan arrives.
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请问，学费贷款的interest大致是多少呢？~5% or higher?
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我查了wall street 的 prime rate, 目前的利率是7.5% :-(. 这几年美国一直加息，一年前的利率还只有5%＋。
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目前人民币贷款的利率应该在6.5%左右，不过考虑到人民币基本上每年升值1%以上，还是用美元贷款比较合算。况且现在美元的利率应该已经到阶段性高点，应该不会再往上上升很多了吧。

kevinhrmUID: 2158364

Hi, 同学，你是从国内过去吗，还是已经在美国了？你的宝宝今年多大了？我在上海，女儿现在14个月，如果有可能，我也想让她在Ann Arbor生活一段时间，相信对于她英语和social ability的帮助不亚于我们那个奇贵的English Learning Program！如果你有托儿所的信息，能否share一下，谢谢！
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Sorry for getting back to you late. Everybody seems quite engaged in the MAP project. Here is some information I've got from one of my Korean classmates. Hope it helps:
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4 X' |) }4 `$ X% O" T$ r3 }- l"Here is my answer, and I hope it will help the student planning to come to Ann Arbor.

% W. J8 f& l- W6 X* o  }1. How is the pre-school/kindergarten education in Ann Arbor? Any recommendation? Is it convenient to go to school if not by car?
Preschool and Kindergarten are different. A Kindergarten is within an Elementary school, so it's free, and there is a school bus. But, a Preschool usually doesn't provide a bus, so you should drive your child to the school. You can choose some apartment near preschool. 5-year-old children go to a Kindergarten, under 5-year go to a Preschool. There are couple of preschools Korean children go. One of them is CDC in Family housing. Just look at their homepage, you can get some information about preschool in Ann Arbor.
) F& k% A( q  Y: n1 r* jhttp://housing.umich.edu/northwood/children.html

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2. How much does it cost to go to pre-school/kindergarten? Is it worthwhile? What's the age requirement?
2 f$ w. e) U: l3 a- G! f" ]' c$ [Average cost of preschool is, I guess, $100 per hour per month. I heard that most preschool have half day class which cost about $400~500 per month. Full day is $800~900 per month.
+ n  m: j  W" tWell, it depends on what is your purpose of sending your child to preschool. In my case, I have to send my child to preschool because I have to go to school.
) L- ]6 A8 ~8 b/ ]I don't know about age requrement very well, but I believe they have quite young babies.

! O+ x6 N2 ]% {7 r3. What is the medical insurance cost for spouse and kids?
# y, C, ]3 `7 J( f: [, ~2 bActually, this is a big issue, when you come here with your family. If you have spouse, the insurance is more than $200 per month. If you have 2 people other than you, the insurance cost is $580 per month. It was less than $500 last year, but they increased almost $100 this year. I hope this information does not disappoint you."
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+ C$ i$ [. i+ H! L$ q2 xPretty scaring to me.  My takeaways are: 1). if your spouse can take care of you child, don't bother to go to pre-school 2). if your spouse can't take care of the family affairs in Ann Arbor, don't bother to take your child aged below 5 to the US.
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/ n9 Q& h# k  }8 q3 q不晓得F2申请的成功机率是多少呢？是不是去了学校的F2只要申请的大多都成功了？
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% _% y$ @/ O( jTwo first year MBAs and former F2s are both female with their husbands in Class of 2004 and Class of 2006 respectively. From my discussion with one of them, though admission is not secured, she has never heard of a failure case before. As she put it, it is definitely a plus.
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" l8 p0 j$ C/ u9 J9 ^6 r9 JFirst of all, you show to the school that you are familiar with the program and the environment. Also, from American admission officers' perspective, your spouse would most likely to accept Ross' offering of admission as they can't understand a couple could be separate from each other for months let alone a year, which on the contrary may be the common case in China.

Secondly, you have opportunity to leave deeper impression on admission officers. Seeing is believing--I think it is easy to understand.

Thirdly, you can help each other in decision making and experience sharing. Not sure how it works, but there should be some synergy (sorry, I use the business jargon again). The program is pretty intensive and it is good if someone can take care of something for you. (I am not that lucky in terms of this, hehe!)

. ?6 H$ p& N2 uThe ony concern I can think of is the financial constraint. Of course you and your spouse should well plan for all the potential outcomes.
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$ U% r3 Y$ Z4 u[ 本帖最后由 kevinhrm 于 2006-7-10 15:46 编辑 ]

kevinhrmUID: 2158364

我想问问看 有谁能advise一下 I-20的process的问题要找international center中的谁来解决？谢谢
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Usually processing I-20 is International Center's job. However, for Ross new admits, Ross admission assistants take care of it. They will collect all your documents and hand them over to the International Center in batches. To figure out who your admission assistant is, just email or call the admission office and you will be routed to someone based on your last name.
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: ~1 d, A1 L. @9 ]The assistant helped me was Karen Hass, it seems they are extremely busy and it is certainly a good idea to make sure that the school had already received all your document (they only received 3 out of 5 pages of my first fax, one of the 2 missing pages was the enrollment confirmation page, instead of sending another fax, I decided to courier everything to Ann Arbor attention to Karen)

ce-dementorUID: 2278805

54321oUID: 2358044

ding

gepoohn1986UID: 2294575

顶！

seachildUID: 2194849

thanks a lot for your sharing!!
3 X& p. b* K5 }+ |5 TQuite good guy you are~