issue36 mars队伍越来越大了

狂枫UID: 111399

Issue36
"The greatness of individuals can be decided only by those who live after them, but not their contemporaries."
提纲：
1.称为伟大，那么一定要是禁得起时间的考验的。
2.在艺术的领域，有一些艺术先锋，只有后来的人才能认识到他们的价值。（又是凡高的例子，土了点）
3.在政治领域里面，同时代的人没有办法正确评价，只有后人能客观评价。
4.虽然当代人伟大的评价也经受住了时间的考验，但可能是一些巧合＆偶然。


Greatness, something we defined as influence someone pose on the society of his or her own and the ones after him or her, can only be named by the person behind.

When we define someone as greatness, we assumed the fame we give will be certainly enduring; if not so it will have no significance. Then Whether value created by an individual lasts can exclusively decided by the scholarships or people behind him, and only can the claim of being great persuasive on the condition that the respect and reputation distributed to him not retreated by the people after him.

Concerning the realm of arts, someone we mark as avant-courier may have been misunderstood by his contemporaries and receive no approval from the establishment of his time. The acknowledge is not given until the critics and the audiences years after his exist can apprehend him, and then appreciate him. Such as the well-known artist Van Gogh, who is known by everyone in the modern world, but held no attention from the contemporaries and left the world with seldom sympathy.

The scenario will be a little different when the field of politics is concerned. For the political leader, the era of his may have credited exaggerated extols and admires to him, for his dominant position or influenced by propaganda of media, or just catering for the appetites of the incumbent for some self-interest pursuits. Take the Chinese leader chairman Mao Ze Dong for example, whether the publicists or the quotidian people are in such an admiration for him that they praise hims as omnipotence, the word every reasonable people will ascribe to nobody. Not until recently that his wrong political decision is rationally discussed in public, and the reputation he deserved attains relevantly. We should enlightened by this case，that contemporaries with whom we are to evaluated not only will miss the overlook of his or her achievements, but provide them with inappropriate eulogies，what must and can only be corrected by people after them.

I cannot deny the fact that some people who was branded as great at their own times and then did endure the test of time. Even if were not the coincidence of history, or the excessively observant critics at his times, however, we cannot declare their greatness a never fades one, until it go down through the river of history and then pan out again by the people at the low reaches. Thus, the real greatness have to been reconfirmed by the people after him.

In retrospect to the history of our civilization, times again some great minds and voice are not discovered years after their death, while some others we claimed as great, and put them on the table for oblation，for which have to retreat into regret and self-mockery later. All these lessons tell that before making any generalization of something concerning the values, the norms, say greatness one of them, we should agree the single measurement to prove its validity will be time, or to say that only people behind qualified to give conclusion.

[ 本帖最后由 狂枫 于 2006-2-21 00:13 编辑 ]

iven19821005UID: 2160156

Issue36
"The greatness of individuals can be decided only by those who live after them, but not their contemporaries."
提纲：
1.称为伟大，那么一定要是禁得起时间的考验的。
2.在艺术的领域，有一些艺术先锋，只有后来的人才能认识到他们的价值。（又是凡高的例子，土了点）
3.在政治领域里面，同时代的人没有办法正确评价，只有后人能客观评价。
4.虽然当代人伟大的评价也经受住了时间的考验，但可能是一些巧合＆偶然。


Greatness, （something we defined as influence someone pose on the society of his or her own and the ones after him or her,  这句话里有太多的代词，看明白就有点吃力了，不知道是不是什么特定的结构，但我的确有点做阅读理解的感觉。于是问题就有了，给ets批改
的人看，他能仔细去想吗？）can only be named by the person behind.

When we define someone as greatness, we assumed the fame we give will be certainly enduring; if not so it will have no  significance. Then Whether value created by （an individual lasts什么意思啊） can exclusively decided by the scholarships or  people behind him, and （only放了就显得有些不通了） can the claim of being great persuasive on the condition that the respect  and reputation distributed to him not retreated by the people after him（这应该是个问句吧）.（这段的论点是好的，但语句不是很流畅，论证粒度也不强，但做为引出后面三段的一段还是不错的，语言改进一下）

Concerning the realm of arts, someone we mark as avant-courier may have been misunderstood by his contemporaries and receive  no approval from the establishment of his time. The acknowledge is not given until the critics and the audiences（ years  after his exist应该加上插入语标记） can apprehend him, and then appreciate him. Such as the well-known artist Van Gogh, who  is known by everyone in the modern world, but held no attention from the contemporaries and left the world with seldom  sympathy. （举完例子后，分析一下比较好吧。否则显得论证不够丰满。）

The scenario will be a little different when the field of politics is concerned. For the political leader, the era of his may  have credited exaggerated extols and admires to him, for his dominant position or influenced by propaganda of media, or just  catering for the appetites of the incumbent for some self-interest pursuits. Take the Chinese leader chairman Mao Ze Dong for  example, whether the publicists or the quotidian people are in such an admiration for him that they praise hims as  omnipotence, （the word every reasonable people will ascribe to nobody什么意思啊？）. Not until recently that his wrong  political decision is rationally discussed in public, and the reputation he deserved attains relevantly. We should  enlightened by this case，that contemporaries with whom we are to evaluated not only will miss the overlook of his or her  achievements, but provide them with inappropriate eulogies，(what must and can only be corrected by people after them有这么强
调的吗).
I cannot deny the fact that some people who was branded as great at their own times and then did endure the test of time.  Even if it were not the coincidence of history, or the excessively observant critics at his times, however, we cannot declare  their greatness a never fades one, until it go down through the river of history and then pan out again by the people at the  low reaches. （这句的虚拟语气和river的论述的确有意思，如果组织的更地道一点就更好了，觉得有点不舒服，或许是我理解的问题）Thus,  the real greatness have to been reconfirmed by the people after him.

In retrospect to the history of our civilization, times again （这个算什么用法啊）some great minds and voice are not  discovered years after their death, while some others we claimed as great, and put them on the table for oblation，for which  have to retreat into regret and self-mockery later.（这句写的有些不通么，你表达的真正意图是什么） All these lessons tell that  before making any generalization of something concerning the values, the norms, say greatness one of them（排比怎么不对称啊） , we should agree the single measurement to prove its validity will be time, or to say that only people behind qualified to  give conclusion.（最后一句也不好，to prove that its......, 后面更理解不了了）

1.topics ,一边倒，但分析的有层次感，这种层次感是值得我学习的。先讲伟大要经受得时间考验。再用两三段来展开b1的论证，不错的提纲
，至少从我的角度这么认为。（我就发觉你的文章有很多好的地方正好是我不够的地方，果然正确）
2.其实第二段和第一段合并怎样，让结构更清晰一点，按孙远的讲法，结构清晰的5段论是最好的。
3.本题难写了，是吧
4.提纲写得不错，但是论证的没前两篇好，语言也不是很流畅。

[ 本帖最后由 iven19821005 于 2006-2-21 20:51 编辑 ]

狂枫UID: 111399

Greatness, influence someone imposing on the society, can only be named by the person behind him or her. When the word greatness coming into our mind, we assume the fame we give will be certainly enduring, if not so it will be of no significance. Then whether the value created by a person will not miss in the river of history can exclusively decide by the scholarships or people behind, and the claim of being great persuasive persuasive on the condition that the respect and reputation attribute to him not retreated by the people after him.


Concerning the realm of arts, someone we mark as avant-courier may have been misunderstood by his contemporaries and receive no approval from the establishment of his time. The acknowledge is not given until the critics and the audiences-years after his exist-can apprehend him, and then appreciate him, Such as the well-known artist Van Gogh, who is known by everyone in the modern world, but held no attention from th contemporaries and left the world with seldom sympathy. The appropriate comment of being great can only given rightfully by the people years after their deaths to artists just like Van Gogh, for ahead of their own times greatly.


When the field of politics is concerned, the estimation will often be tortured by the person of the same era. The era of the political leader may have credited extols and admires to him which he do not actually deserve, given his dominant position or influenced by propaganda of media of that time, or just catering for the appetites of the incumbent for some self-interest pursuits. Take the Chinese leader chairman Mao for example, whether the publicists or the quotidian people are in such an admiration for him that they praise him as omnipotence, a word should given to no human under any condition. Not until recently that his incorrect political decisions are rationally discussed in public, and the reputation he deserved attains accordingly. We should enlightened by this case, that the people of same era with the person to give evaluation will not only over look his achievements, but also provide them with inappropriate eulogies, which can only be corrected by the people after them.


I cannot be ignorance of the fact that some people who have been branded as great at their own times and did endure the test of time.  Even if it were not the coincidence of history, or the excessively observant critics at his times, however, we cannot declare  their greatness an enduring one, until it go down through the river of history and then pan out again by the people at the  low reaches. Thus, the determination of real greatness still have to been in the hand of the offer spring.


In retrospect to the history of our civilization, more often than not some great minds and voice are buried in oblivion and not digged out until many years later, while some others we claimed as great, and put them on the table for oblation，for which  have to retreat into regret and self-mockery in the end. All these lessons tell that  before making any generalization of something concerning the values, the standards, say greatness one of them, we should agree that the real one should be that endures the test of time, in another  word, only off spring are qualified to  give conclusion.