14年秋季GRE提纲互改小组-issue4

skywongchiuUID: 3261705

謝謝smily-ray的資訊和王老師的點評,

我也寫了提網, 希望王老師給予意見, 謝謝。

4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.

Personally, I agree with the speaker’s claim. It is not doubt that scandals – defined as some actions or behavior violating the social norms – are a key factor attracting and influencing our attention to problems that have not been considered by us before the scandals. For instances, scandals have brought our attention to the problem of drug abuse in the youth in Hong Kong, and it also attracted our attention to the problem of policy-making in our society. However, the opponents might not agree with the speaker and might state that other factors – such as the ability of the speaker – might also be capable to manipulate the audience’s attention to the problems of drug abuse or policy-making in the society.

To start with, scandals are the most powerful tool to manipulate our attention to the problem of drug abuse in the youth in Hong Kong. Although 社會上有部份人提出我們要關注青少年毒品滥用的問題, 主流社會一直都沒有真正關心這個問題。直到有新閒報導, 青少年為了賺取金錢购买毒品, 他/她們願意和不同的人進行不道德的性行為 or 進行一些犯罪的活動 – 包括走私私煙 – 賺取金錢。當以上的醜聞被報導後, 主流社會不但開始關注青少年毒品滥用的問題, 他們還要求政府馬上立法處理青少年毒品滥用的現象。

Furthermore, scandals play a critical role in the policy-making in our territory. Although Lawmakers in our city 經常讨论有什麼政策是政府必須要做的, 例如最低工資。可是, 政府一直都沒有在意是否要推行最低工資。不過, 當媒體報導指出香港政府是無良政府, 政府任由僱主剥夺員工應得的基本福利(報道指出有一位老人家工作一小時只得到1元美金(25% of the median hourly payment in the city))。政府隨後便進行了立法。

Admittedly, opponents might argue that a speaker with good narrative techniques would be capable to attract audience’s attention to the problem including the drug abusive and policy-making in the city. 我不反對a person with good narrative techniques可以吸引到聽眾的注意力和告訴聽眾有什麼社會問題我們要去關注。不過我要指出, scandals 是一種常被講者運用的 narrative technique 去吸引聽眾對於問題的關注度。  

tesolchinaUID: 2191404

skywongchiu 发表于 2014-11-8 00:27
謝謝smily-ray的資訊和王老師的點評,

我也寫了提網, 希望王老師給予意見, 謝謝。

4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.

Personally, I agree with the speaker’s claim. It is not doubt that scandals – defined as some actions or behavior violating the social norms – are a key factor attracting and influencing our attention to problems that have not been considered by us before the scandals. For instances, scandals have brought our attention to the problem of drug abuse in the youth in Hong Kong, and it also attracted our attention to the problem of policy-making in our society. 这部分是你的主要观点 虽然你提出了丑闻可以吸引注意力 但是并没有强调useful  错过这个关键词使你的观点变得不那么切题 或许只需要在措辞上补充一下就可以了  指出useful in developing new policies through legislation


However, the opponents might not agree with the speaker and might state that other factors – such as the ability of the speaker – might also be capable to manipulate the audience’s attention to the problems of drug abuse or policy-making in the society.
不太确定你这里提出的可能的挑战是什么 你想说有人利用丑闻来故意引起公众对某些问题的关注？
这个和你前面提出的观点并没有很大的冲突啊



To start with, scandals are the most powerful tool to manipulate our attention to the problem of drug abuse in the youth in Hong Kong. Although 社會上有部份人提出我們要關注青少年毒品滥用的問題, 主流社會一直都沒有真正關心這個問題。直到有新閒報導, 青少年為了賺取金錢购买毒品, 他/她們願意和不同的人進行不道德的性行為 or 進行一些犯罪的活動 – 包括走私私煙 – 賺取金錢。當以上的醜聞被報導後, 主流社會不但開始關注青少年毒品滥用的問題, 他們還要求政府馬上立法處理青少年毒品滥用的現象。

Furthermore, scandals play a critical role in the policy-making in our territory. Although Lawmakers in our city 經常讨论有什麼政策是政府必須要做的, 例如最低工資。可是, 政府一直都沒有在意是否要推行最低工資。不過, 當媒體報導指出香港政府是無良政府, 政府任由僱主剥夺員工應得的基本福利(報道指出有一位老人家工作一小時只得到1元美金(25% of the median hourly payment in the city))。政府隨後便進行了立法。

我觉得前两段的例子和论述都不错 主要就是要强调useful这个点
但是challenge这部分 感觉写得不够好

Admittedly, opponents might argue that a speaker with good narrative techniques would be capable to attract audience’s attention to the problem including the drug abusive and policy-making in the city. 我不反對a person with good narrative techniques可以吸引到聽眾的注意力和告訴聽眾有什麼社會問題我們要去關注。不過我要指出, scandals 是一種常被講者運用的 narrative technique 去吸引聽眾對於問題的關注度。

gzc405933323UID: 3574833

王老师，这是我今天写的第二个提纲了，请多多指教！

Scandals are valuable in disclosing concealed social problems and the dark side of the political system and powerful in pressing the government to solve those problems. However, some people might argue that scandals distract people from the positive aspects of the society and the government, but the public has the capability of acknowledging the upsides of the society and the government while concerning about the downsides.

1.        Scandals play a significant role in unveiling the underlying social problems.
例子：2008中国牛奶三聚氰胺（melamine）污染黑幕。
迫于公众舆论压力，三鹿破产，中国政府开始大幅度规范食品安全。

2. Scandals can effectively divulge the hidden unethical and corrupted behaviors of the politicians
   e.g. 1. 水门事件（Watergate scandal）
   e.g. 2  棱镜门（PRISM）和Edward Snowden（这话题会不会不河蟹然后被判低分？）
   e.g.3 1989台湾拉法叶军购弊案（候选例子），台湾军方高层在国防项目招标过程中收受竞标军火商利益。

3.        Some might claim that scandals will cultivate the cynicism in the public and undermine their trust in the government and their positive attitude to the society. However, majority of the public are capable of critical thinking and keeping attentive to the bright sides as well as the dark side. 例子：尽管许多美国民众注意到棱镜计划侵犯个人隐私不道德的一面，他们还是看到棱镜计划高效反恐，维护社会安全的一面.

4. Conclusion

skywongchiuUID: 3261705

tesolchina 发表于 2014-11-8 23:40
4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or r ...

謝謝王老師意思, 我一會兒寫好再把整篇文放上來。
謝謝

tesolchinaUID: 2191404

gzc405933323 发表于 2014-11-9 07:52
王老师，这是我今天写的第二个提纲了，请多多指教！

Scandals are valuable in disclosing concealed so ...

4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.



王老师，这是我今天写的第二个提纲了，请多多指教！

Scandals are valuable in disclosing concealed social problems and the dark side of the political system and powerful in pressing the government to solve those problems. However, some people might argue that scandals distract people from the positive aspects of the society and the government, but the public has the capability of acknowledging the upsides of the society and the government while concerning about the downsides.

1.        Scandals play a significant role in unveiling the underlying social problems.
例子：2008中国牛奶三聚氰胺（melamine）污染黑幕。
迫于公众舆论压力，三鹿破产，中国政府开始大幅度规范食品安全。

从这个例子中可以更细致的提炼观点
有用之处不仅在于暴露问题 还在于促使政府改革制度  


2. Scandals can effectively divulge the hidden unethical and corrupted behaviors of the politicians
   e.g. 1. 水门事件（Watergate scandal）
   e.g. 2  棱镜门（PRISM）和Edward Snowden（这话题会不会不河蟹然后被判低分？）
   e.g.3 1989台湾拉法叶军购弊案（候选例子），台湾军方高层在国防项目招标过程中收受竞标军火商利益。

嗯 上一段强调制度的改变 这一段强调挖出有问题的官员
感觉例子不要太多 虽然范文也试过一句一个例子 感觉不太好驾驭 把一个例子分析透彻或许更好



3.        Some might claim that scandals will cultivate the cynicism in the public and undermine their trust in the government and their positive attitude to the society. However, majority of the public are capable of critical thinking and keeping attentive to the bright sides as well as the dark side. 例子：尽管许多美国民众注意到棱镜计划侵犯个人隐私不道德的一面，他们还是看到棱镜计划高效反恐，维护社会安全的一面.

你这个challenge提得很好 但counter似乎不太够
你可以指出 这种丑闻的曝光本身就说明政府有自我纠错的能力 制度可以改进 有问题的人可以下课  等等
所以不会出现犬儒或不信任的情况


4. Conclusion

gzc405933323UID: 3574833

31分钟写出来的，可能有点纰漏   


   The claim argues that university ought to require every student to learn a broad range of courses beyond the student's major areas of study because it is the best way for a student to obtain legit education by gaining knowledge from a variety of academic disciplines. Although it is not desirable for universities to force all students to learn various non-major courses, it is conducive for students to obtain knowledge from a wide range of academic fields.
       Knowledge from other academic fields can be conducive to a student's major study. Branches of knowledge are seldom independent. They usually intertwine with one another. Therefore, it is important for students to acquire knowledge from other academic realms that are closely related to the majors. For instance, many economic students might find psychology valuable for their coursework because many economic theories are based on the decision of individuals. It is indisputable that psychology plays a significant role in shaping individuals decisions. Therefore, psychological theories can offer effective improvement to the classical economic theories. In this way, students can obtain inspiration from psychological theories to enhance their understanding of economic models or even inspire them to modify the economic model they learned.
      In addition, taking courses of different fields can provide the opportunities for the students to meet students and professors of different academic and professional backgrounds for mutual learning and future career opportunities. Students of different majors choose different focus of study. Therefore, when a student is taking non-major courses, he or she will never lack the chances to meet new people of another field of study. Different fields of students might have quite different skills and ways of approaching problems. Therefore, learning from students of non-major fields can improve a student's skills and perspectives from which he or she handles academic issues. Besides mutual learning, potential career opportunities is another benefit for meeting people of different backgrounds. Probably one student can be referred to his or her dream positions because the new people he or she met might have a close relationship with the recruiters. This situation is very likely in business schools.
      However, some students of demanding majors including engineering and physics might not have the time for non-major courses; therefore, the non-major field of study might distract them from their major coursework. Many students in engineering and physics need to stay in labs and major courses for their in-course research all day long. Therefore, they  lack the time for other fields of study. If the university forces them to take non-major courses, the university will distract them from the major fields of study. As a result they will not get effective major education, which is a undesirable outcome for both of those students and the university.
       Moreover, the policy doesn't respect the academic freedom of some students who lack the skills in pursuing some non-major knowledge. Most of the students choose their majors according to their respective skills . Therefore, if the universities compel them to choose many courses beyond their majors, especially the ones which they lack the skills or interest to learn, the universities are acting against the principle of academic freedom because they are forcing the students to do something they are unable  to do. For example, it will be infeasible and even imperative for a university to force a disabled liberal arts and science students to take physical education courses because they might be unable to do sports.
         In sum, it is beneficial for some students to learn a variety of non-major courses to enhance their major fields of study and meet new peoples. However, it is not the case for other students to take a broad range of non-majors courses due to their limit in time and skills. Therefore, it is not desirable for universities to impose requirements on the non-major courses that students should learn. Instead, it is recommended that the colleges offer a variety of courses which students can choose from to satisfy their desire for the pursuit of knowledge. Choices are better than requirements.

tesolchinaUID: 2191404

raikkonen36 发表于 2014-11-7 18:23
Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ...

Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.


Scandals indeed focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could. Nonetheless, scandals serve as a double-edged sword in general, meaning that scandals can impose both positive and negative influence to a society. As a whole effect in general, scandals are useful for a society.

为什么你对题目的要求会视而不见？

be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.

我不反对你说既有正面的影响又有负面的影响
但是 如果你想提出一个整合的观点 就需要明确地指出在什么情况下是正面的影响 什么情况下是负面的影响

你的主旨句和后面的主题句之间没有相互呼应

你的主题句写得很模糊 比如some aspects指的是什么  
比如negative influence指的又是什么

其实你举的很多例子都挺好 但是从例子中提炼观点以及将分论点整合成总论点的能力有待加强吧

我很怀疑你到底有没有看我的1+3模型
https://bbs.gter.net/thread-1777232-1-1.html 54楼

lisa_CUID: 2678347

4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.
没有相关Issue题目。
请回帖时按照指引链接列出英语提纲并用汉语解释并根据指引点评楼上的提纲。 第一个回帖的同学不必点评。
指引链接：https://bbs.gter.net/thread-1777364-1-1.html


强迫自己限时，如果结构松散见谅啦

主旨句: As for issues other than personal life, like politic and science, definitely scandals are useful because reveal problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could. As for issues about personal life, however, attentions caused by scandals are not useful but problemic, disturbing people's people's lives and misguiding the public attention.


TS1: Without doubt, scandals in topics like politic and science are useful because they have power to regulate people, guide people to work in professional way and help promote the social justice through revealing problems that few people could publicly discuss.
政治科学类的话题有用，因为通过揭示一些不太方便公开讨论的问题，丑闻能起到监督作用、引导人们遵守职业道德、推进社会公正的作用。
（举尼克松水门事件，丑闻的出现可以让人们认识到问题所在，更多的人关注这个问题后可以使违法行为无处可逃。这些丑闻和后继新闻的跟进给人们反面的教训，害怕被丑闻缠身的政客就会规避这些违法行为更有职业操守，社会的公平正义也得到提升。同时再如日本的ＳＴＡＰ干细胞学术造假事件，虽然至今不知道结果如何，但是使人们开始关注学术造假的问题，也提醒科研人员不要造假，否则身败名裂，更好建立科研秩序。）



TS2: As for issues focusing on personal life, however, scandals are not welcomed, not only for people who are involved in, but also for the whole society.
（对个人，侵犯隐私权。如张国荣。对社会，容易使社会舆论焦点转向不重要的大人物私生活上，从而模糊焦点。）


TS3: While someone may argue that issues about personal life can also be beneficial - for example, if a famous politician is a heavy drinker, scandals about his addicted to alcohol would push him to be moderate in drinking, and thus his working efficiency would proved and definitely the whole society will benefit from his better working attitude, disadvantages of scandals about personal life are dominant.
（拿heavy drinker这个例子来说，虽然能够起到一点监督作用，但是也容易误导公众尤其是缺乏自制力的年轻人，他们会觉得成功的政客都嗜酒，那自己也可以过度饮酒，而且年轻人更容易学习不好的习性。这些丑闻吸引年轻人注意的同时，也在误导他们。）

max940623UID: 3559548

还有6天考试还在写提纲看来得二战了:lol 请老师多多指教

V1
TS
Admittedly, to some extent scandals are always inspiring since they provide the public with a different perspective from that of speaker or reformer. However, some scandals without authenticity and accuracy could only distract people’s attention and waste their time. Only the scandal that fulfill these two requirements could lead public attention to the correct place. Moreover, a beneficial scandal should be able to encourage action after attracting the attention.

KW: scandal, useful, attention, problems, new way

Ts1
If the scandals is not true or accurate enough, they will never be useful. Instead, most of them appears to be harmful.
不真实的丑闻举例：MJ娈童丑闻，给明星个人和社会都有不良影响。
不准确的丑闻举例：中国媒体对于官员小三的丑闻报道是真实的，但不应该如此浓墨重彩将整个社会的注意力浪费在此。

Ts2
On the contrary, the scandals with accuracy as well as authenticity could enlighten people and remind them the correct place to focus on.
水门事件
棱镜丑闻

Ts3
In fact, only attracting the public awareness on the key problems is not enough for a scandal to be defined as “useful”. Instead, it should provoke the solution to the problem.
继续用上面两个例子，水门事件后促进了美国社会对政府的监管（会议记录公开+竞选资金限制），反观棱镜爆出至今没有激发任何应对措施难称有用。

tesolchinaUID: 2191404

lisa_C 发表于 2014-11-15 00:42
4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or refor ...

4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.
没有相关Issue题目。
请回帖时按照指引链接列出英语提纲并用汉语解释并根据指引点评楼上的提纲。 第一个回帖的同学不必点评。
指引链接：https://bbs.gter.net/thread-1777364-1-1.html


强迫自己限时，如果结构松散见谅啦

主旨句: As for issues other than personal life, like politic and science, definitely scandals are useful because 语法 reveal problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could. As for issues about personal life, however, attentions caused by scandals are not useful but problemic, disturbing people's people's lives and misguiding the public attention.

明显的语法错误 自己应该能检查出来啊
attention不可数
attentions caused 搭配


TS1: Without doubt, scandals in topics like politic and science are useful because they have power to regulate people, guide people to work in professional way and help promote the social justice through revealing problems that few people could publicly discuss.
政治科学类的话题有用，因为通过揭示一些不太方便公开讨论的问题，丑闻能起到监督作用、引导人们遵守职业道德、推进社会公正的作用。
（举尼克松水门事件，丑闻的出现可以让人们认识到问题所在，更多的人关注这个问题后可以使违法行为无处可逃。这些丑闻和后继新闻的跟进给人们反面的教训，害怕被丑闻缠身的政客就会规避这些违法行为更有职业操守，社会的公平正义也得到提升。同时再如日本的ＳＴＡＰ干细胞学术造假事件，虽然至今不知道结果如何，但是使人们开始关注学术造假的问题，也提醒科研人员不要造假，否则身败名裂，更好建立科研秩序。）

这一段的内容有点太多
讲一个方面的例子就够了


TS2: As for issues focusing on personal life, however, scandals are not welcomed, not only for people who are involved in, but also for the whole society.
（对个人，侵犯隐私权。如张国荣。对社会，容易使社会舆论焦点转向不重要的大人物私生活上，从而模糊焦点。）




TS3: While someone may argue that issues about personal life can also be beneficial - for example, if a famous politician is a heavy drinker, scandals about his addicted to alcohol would push him to be moderate in drinking, and thus his working efficiency would proved and definitely the whole society will benefit from his better working attitude, disadvantages of scandals about personal life are dominant.
（拿heavy drinker这个例子来说，虽然能够起到一点监督作用，但是也容易误导公众尤其是缺乏自制力的年轻人，他们会觉得成功的政客都嗜酒，那自己也可以过度饮酒，而且年轻人更容易学习不好的习性。这些丑闻吸引年轻人注意的同时，也在误导他们。）


你的这个主题句好像和后面的汉语解释意思不太一致
注意不是issue beneficial 是scandal
你整个这个主题句的表达语法很有问题

tesolchinaUID: 2191404

max940623 发表于 2014-11-16 21:52
还有6天考试还在写提纲看来得二战了 请老师多多指教

V1

4) Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.


V1
TS
Admittedly, to some extent scandals are always inspiring since they provide the public with a different perspective from that of speaker or reformer. However, some scandals without authenticity and accuracy could only distract people’s attention and waste their time. Only the scandal that fulfill these two requirements could lead public attention to the correct place. Moreover, a beneficial scandal should be able to encourage action after attracting the attention.

inspiring 这个词不太合适
different perspective from表达有问题
some scandals without authenticity and accuracy表达有问题

be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position. 这个你没有回应




KW: scandal, useful, attention, problems, new way

Ts1
If the scandals is not true or accurate enough, they will never be useful. Instead, most of them appears to be harmful.
不真实的丑闻举例：MJ娈童丑闻，给明星个人和社会都有不良影响。
不准确的丑闻举例：中国媒体对于官员小三的丑闻报道是真实的，但不应该如此浓墨重彩将整个社会的注意力浪费在此。

注意主谓一致


Ts2
On the contrary, the scandals with accuracy as well as authenticity could enlighten people and remind them the correct place to focus on.
水门事件
棱镜丑闻
remind them the correct place to focus on. 表达有问题




Ts3
In fact, only attracting the public awareness on the key problems is not enough for a scandal to be defined as “useful”. Instead, it should provoke the solution to the problem.
继续用上面两个例子，水门事件后促进了美国社会对政府的监管（会议记录公开+竞选资金限制），反观棱镜爆出至今没有激发任何应对措施难称有用。


这个点和题目有些偏离 题目不是要你说应该怎么样
而是问你scandals是不是有用

如果你的意思是只有能带来改变的丑闻才有用  那么和上段的只要真实地丑闻就有用不就矛盾了么  

qinjichunUID: 3544209

Issue 4 Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or reformer ever could.
Write a response in which you discuss the extent to which you agree or disagree with the claim. In developing and supporting your position, be sure to address the most compelling reasons and/or examples that could be used to challenge your position.

Whether the scandals have positive impacts on society depends on whether the scandals involve private individuals of public affairs.

For the scandals involving private individuals, these always violate people’s privacy and only aim to satisfy the curiosity of public. 比如paparazzi会偷拍明星走光以
及他们与什么人交往，leakage of Jennifer Lawrence’s nude photo这不仅不道德的侵犯别人隐私，也对我们社会没有积极作用。（走光怎么翻译？accidental exposure?）
On the other hand, exposure of malfeasance of government officials and institutions is usually beneficial to bring about reform in the policies or prevent bureaucracy to prevail. 比如watergate scandal, 尽管Nixon尝试掩盖但the coverage dramatically increased the publicity and the political repercussion.这也导致的政府人员的重组以及相关法律的改变，促进了选举的公正，对社会有着重大意思。

Some people may argue that the revelation of public figures’ misconducts may focus the attention on moral issues, but if this potential positive influence is derived from violation of other’s privacy and immoral or illegal conducts, it becomes inane and undesirable. 比如默多克利用偷听装置来收集名人丑闻，虽然开始时有积极影响,但这种方式曝光后还是遭到了一致的批评以及法律的制裁，同时这个事件也是新闻业的灾难。

老师跟您之前的思路基本一样，主要举了列子看一下，如果没什么问题准备开始写全文了

tesolchinaUID: 2191404

qinjichun 发表于 2014-11-19 19:52
Issue 4 Scandals are useful because they focus our attention on problems in ways that no speaker or ...

wardrobe malfunction能算scandal么
除此之外 这个提纲挺好

qinjichunUID: 3544209

tesolchina 发表于 2014-11-22 17:55
wardrobe malfunction能算scandal么
除此之外 这个提纲挺好

政府人员渎职也算丑闻吧
scandal: a disgraceful event

或者改成 political scandals always involve malfeasance of officials, which is beneficial.这样能好点？

tesolchinaUID: 2191404

qinjichun 发表于 2014-11-22 20:59
政府人员渎职也算丑闻吧
scandal: a disgraceful event

wardrobe malfunction 走光