Discussion－How SPECIFIC is enough for TWE

TaylorUID: 147672

How specific is enough for examples in TWE?
I am still wondering whether my examples are specific or concrete enough.

Should the name of people in the example or the exact activity be mentioned in  details?

Please look at this paragraph:

In other words, students are able to ask questions as soon as they can not follow the teacher, such as an axiom in economics. Then teachers will repeat what they said and can even describe it in various ways, from history perspective or by using math to prove it.

Is that concrete enough?

Another one:

As a case in point, we like to discuss some problems after class, math problem mostly. We find that we are unable to solve problems without fully understanding some concepts or definitions related.

It seems that this paragraph is not discussed as well as the former one. What do you think of it?

I would like to hear your idears and suggestions about them.
Thank you

[ Last edited by Taylor on 2005-8-7 at 13:09 ]

PhenolphthaleinUID: 2101294

I think that every example has to be made reference with the subject of the composition. Well, I mean that we can't analyse one example without knowing the thesis of the composition. So would you mind telling us the topic of the composition? thanks.

TaylorUID: 147672

Originally posted by Phenolphthalein at 2005-8-8 03:03
I think that every example has to be made reference with the subject of the composition. Well, I mean that we can't analyse one example without knowing the thesis of the composition. So would you m ...

The full edition of my essay is below:

Education is a process involving communication between teachers and students, and among students as well. As we perceive, face-to-face is definitely the best way for communication. Granted that using technology such as computers or televisions can positively affect educations, it can not take the place of the role of traditional schools.

To begin with, traditional schools allow a close relationship between students and teachers which will contribute to the quality of education. In other words, students are able to ask questions as soon as they can not follow the teacher, such as an axiom in economics. Then teachers will repeat what they said and can even describe it in various ways, from history perspective or by using math to prove it. Conversely, if teaching by technology were the used, it would not allow such effective problem solving for students.

In addition, only in traditional schools, can face-to-face discussion among students be achieved, which weighs a lot in learning processes. As a case in point, we like to discuss some problems after class, math problem mostly. We find that we are unable to solve problems without fully understanding some concepts or definitions related. In the discussion, everyone shows their own understandings, some are creative, about the concepts and definitions from various aspects, which will then greatly enlighten each other. When we are using computers or televisions at home for study, what we face is the cool screen, which is unable to communicate with.

Admittedly, televisions and computers bring conviences to us, we do not have to hurry for school everyday and we are freely to choose the subject we prefer. However, it possibly makes us lazier and brings negative attitude towards life.

In short, I prefer traditional schools because it allow instant effective communication between teachers and students, and it also create a good study atmosphere among students. And technology for education can just add to it, instead of replacing it.


Thank you:)

PhenolphthaleinUID: 2101294

Hi, thanks for your sharing.

OK. If I were correct, I guess this is about a topic like" compare and contrast the differences between traditional schools and advanced technology used that might be in place of schools"? something like that?

Before I comment on your composition, I would like to state the following points:
1: I took TOEFL before it changes so that my suggestion may not be adequate.
2: It is only MY points of view, it doesn't mean that what I will say is correct. :)

Now gotta say something, hehe.

At the beginning of your essay, it seems to me that you are trying to compare the merits and drawbacks between these two modes of education in terms of communication. Because you stated" Education is a process involving communication between teachers and students, and among students as well." You put this sentence as the first one and if possible, I treat it as the topic sentence.

then, you made reference with two examples convincing how communication merits could contribute to the quality of students' understanding about teachers' lecture (example 1), and how face-to-face discussion could benefit the students. However, I felt that these two examples are somehow the same. Why I think so? because in the first example used, you stated the case when student's CAN'T follow teachers' lecuture, then how traditional schools could effectively solve this problem. nevertheless, you mentioned "We find that we are unable to solve problems without fully understanding some concepts or definitions related. In the discussion, everyone shows their own understandings, some are creative, about the concepts and definitions from various aspects, which will then greatly enlighten each other. " Do you think that they are more or less the same? ^_^.

As to improve for the first example, I think that for communication strengths, you could say something like communication could enable the mutual understanding between teachers and students, and to be taught by a real human being is more interesting than facing a cold computer. (only suggestion, you can certainly use some other cases)

for the second example, I consider that the original one is suitable and adequate.

Ok, above is just what I think and feel about your essay. Hopefully my advice and suggestion would be useful to you.

Just for reference purposes.


:)

best luck of you!

ruru605UID: 199280

Originally posted by Phenolphthalein at 2005-8-8 09:37
Because you stated" Education is a process involving communication between teachers and students, and among students as well." You put this sentence as the first one and if possible, I treat it as the topic sentence

Do you think that they are more or less the same?
for the second example, I consider that the original one is suitable and adequate

As it was described by the Phenolphthalein , the sentence " Education is a process involving communication between teachers and students, and among students as well."  is not proper to be the first sentence. You can use  the structure such   as " It says that tranditional schools can be replaced  by  using technology . However, as far as i concerns, ......" or "Can using computers and televisions take the place of tranditional schools?  In my opinion, ....."

I think you can use such structures in most essays of toefl.

ruru605UID: 199280

Originally posted by Taylor at 2005-8-8 08:47

Do you think that they are more or less the same?
for the second example, I consider that the original one is suitable and adequate

I find it a little difficult to give examples but i think it is good to give these two examples. If you just unite them to be only one, it is not proper. The number of the essay in toefl exam is at least two.

TaylorUID: 147672

Originally posted by Phenolphthalein at 2005-8-8 09:37
Hi, thanks for your sharing.

OK. If I were correct, I guess this is about a topic like" compare and contrast the differences between traditional schools and advanced technology used that m ...

Phenolphthalein, thank you very much!
I am quite impressed by your valuable idears and suggestions:eek:

There are still one question that I would like to consult your advices.

My question is:
The first sentence "Education is a process involving communication between teachers and students, and among students as well" indictes that I will narrow the topic to the crucial role of communication, instead of discusing the contrast between to learning ways. I am not sure whether it is proper to do so.

My vindication for the examples:;P
In fact, examples relating to communications are, to large extent, the same. However, after I narrow the topic to communication, I would like to demonstrate that communication benefit education in two relationships, one is teacher-student relationship, and the other is student-student.Though they are seemly the same, they actually indicat two aspects.

Finally,
Your example suggested is more suitable and persuasive than mine in the firt paragraph

[ Last edited by Taylor on 2005-8-8 at 13:26 ]

TaylorUID: 147672

Originally posted by ruru605 at 2005-8-8 11:56


As it was described by the Phenolphthalein , the sentence " Education is a process involving communication between teachers and students, and among students as well."  is not proper t ...

Thank you for your advice.
But I do not think models like that would benefit.
And my own model is't born till now,;P

PhenolphthaleinUID: 2101294

Originally posted by Taylor at 2005-8-8 13:20


Phenolphthalein, thank you very much!
I am quite impressed by your valuable idears and suggestions:eek:

There are still one question that I would like to consult your advices.

My questio ...

Hi again.
First thanks for accepting my ideas. :D

Then about the question you are unclear of. Well, narrowing down a topic is always a wise way in order to focus on a particular composition subject. HOWEVER, I consider that it is very important for me to know the instruction of your essay, i.e. to which topic you wrote this passage to. hehe.... I just found it difficult to explain it in English, so used Chinese. ;P

can you write the instructions of your essay here?

Thank you very much. :)

[ Last edited by joe824 on 2005-8-8 at 15:07 ]

TaylorUID: 147672

Originally posted by Phenolphthalein at 2005-8-8 14:44



Hi again.
First thanks for accepting my ideas. :D

Then about the question you are unclear of. Well, narrowing down a topic is always a wise way in order to focus on a particular composit ...

Oh, I am sorry I forgot that.
The topic is:

Students may have the choice of studying at home by using technology such as computers or televisions or of studying at traditional schools. Which would you prefer?

haha,Chinese words would be deleted as long as they are discovered by administrators here:lol

Looking forward to your suggestions:)

PhenolphthaleinUID: 2101294

Originally posted by Taylor at 2005-8-8 17:1
Students may have the choice of studying at home by using technology such as computers or televisions or of studying at traditional schools. Which would you prefer?

Hehe, I just wanted to ask where are those four chinese characters. ;P. I am a newcomer here so I am unaware of the regulation here... Very responsible moderators ! :D

Oh ok, so here is the topic... um... If I were about to write about it, I think I will not narrow the topic down to communication perspective because it seems a bit restricted.

So below is my outline of this subject. (Only for reference usage)

1st paragraph: Generally rephrase the sentence appeared in the topic and then address my main point of view, i.e. Schools are much more beneficial to students than home school.

2nd paragraph:  Schools provide the environment of group work, therefore students could be able to establish their abilities to work with other people, thus being more coorperative. Then give one example, say, practical work or basketball team.

3rd paragraph: I may use your communication part.  

4th: summarize and then give some future horizon.

Since the question asks for "which would you prefer" so I don't think it is necessary to talk about home school in details, of course adequately mention home school is important at some place in the composition.

Just my opinions, hope it could help you somehow. :)

P.S. if the word limit is not meet ( I mean too few words ^_^), I may say some drawbacks of home school such as it can only provide the student isolated environment, no communication, no team work, just a cold computer or so.

[ Last edited by Phenolphthalein on 2005-8-8 at 17:49 ]

TaylorUID: 147672

Originally posted by Phenolphthalein at 2005-8-8 17:41



Hehe, I just wanted to ask where are those four chinese characters. ;P. I am a newcomer here so I am unaware of the regulation here... Very responsible moderators ! :D

Oh ok, so here is th ...

Excellent!! Thank you!

Your outline fairly enlightens me, while the main idea of my work is sort of limited, which embarrasses me;P

If you are free some time, I wish you can give me advices or tips about my future TWE works at this board or at my blog :http://spaces.msn.com/members/toefl0820/
haha,seems I am posting an advertisement:lol:lol Because you are virtually a kind-hearted person. No time, Never mind:)

Whatever, I appreciate your writing ability and your ideas and thank you for your help again!:handshake

[ Last edited by Taylor on 2005-8-8 at 18:22 ]

PhenolphthaleinUID: 2101294

You are welcome.

My writing skills are just of average, so please don't trust my ideas very much. :D

PhenolphthaleinUID: 2101294

I will visit your blog and give some "advices" :D it would be my pleasure to do so.

I am free now so time is not a problem . :)

PhenolphthaleinUID: 2101294

Finally I think your TWE essay is well written.

First, your vocabulary is wide-ranged. and also you have good command of phrases. :) I quite appreciate.

Second, I want to encourage you. Writting is not difficult at all! what you need to do is to look down on it :)  and practice enough. Be confident !

Then you will be fine !