issue 147 传统v.s现代

crazyjooUID: 2805124

TOPIC: ISSUE147 - "Tradition and modernization are incompatible. One must choose between them."
WORDS: 672          TIME: 00:47:00

position: modernization and tradition can coexist. modernization do not
surpass tradition in all areas..
1.modernization does show its superioty over tradition in many aspects, no
matter at material level or at spiritual level.
1.1   transportation (airplane / carriage)
       computer( release people from repetive grueling task)
       Internet(communication) wikipedia)
2.discard the tradition as a whole?     
2.1 traditional culture provide guidelines to us ( three kingdoms)
2.2 traditional moral standard shoule be treasured since the materalism
brought by modernization is deteriorating the bottom line of moral standard
to sum up: they can complement each other well due to their difference(这个difference其实是想表达 现代化带来物质的价值，传统带来的更多的是文化方面的价值，他们侧重不同。这个侧重不知道怎么表达哦是好，抑或是必须要再写一段讲他们的可相容性么？求教！）

While we are enjoying various benefits brought by modernization, the tradition culture appears to be useless to us. Some people might even say that tradition and modernization are incompatible since tradition is backward and serves to impede the process of modernization. However, some people content that we should not underestimate the value of tradition. In this light, is it necessary for us to only choose one of them? In my point of view, they can coexist and complement each other well.

Few people would not appreciate the convenience brought by modernization, that is, the advancement of sciences and technology. With the presence of aircraft and automobile, people do not have to stand with the boring  journey any longer. It is not uncommon to see that many people work in U.S and fly to Europe for vocations. Simply clicking on the buttons of cell phone, we can communicate with people all around the world. Moreover, by establishing international database, scholars and scientists can exchange their ideas and cooperate in a project.  Similarly, we university students learn many things from Internet website such as Wikipedia. We can post our ideas on the forms as well as appreciate other different opinions, all of which broaden our view sight and grant us a different perspective. All in all, modernization not only improve the quality of daily life but also rich our inner world.

For that matter, should we really need to abandon tradition? It is true that modernization show its superiority over tradition in many aspects especially in the improvement of equipment and facilities; after all, few one would prefer a carriage over a car. However, traditional culture can still provide guidance for people today since the modern lives and traditional culture are essentially the same to some extend. Likewise, the moral standard remains the same over extended period. Traditional culture has been served to revise people's value system, and always will. These two aspects will be further analyzed as follows, respectively.

In fact, lots of people turn to tradition for guidance since many eminent traditional literature works epitomize the intent nature of the events which seldom change. One example aptly illustrates this point involved the Chinese novel---'' The Three Kingdoms''--a famous book recording the wars and complex relationships between three kingdoms in ancient China.  It's not surprising to see that many business or political leaders consider this novel as their favorite book. To hide your advantage so that your competitors may underestimate what you really get. To ally with other competitors to defend against the strongest one in order to survive. By learning these strategies, leaders as well as common people come to learn how to make a good plan when it comes to a intricate situation. That is to say, they learn how get a lion's share in the market and how to avoid mammoth losses when the loss is inevitable.

Moreover, tradition plays an important role in preventing people from deviating from their moral standard. For example, in China, materialism is the by-product of modernization. Immersing in the comfort and convenience of modernization, many people shift their cynosure from moral standard to money. They earn as much money as they can by all means regardless whether their behavior will bring undesirable consequence to the society. More and more people place more weight on money than moral. Wealth gradually becomes the only yardstick of the value of a person. Fortunately, the far-reaching influence of tradition alleviates this problem. The teachings of Confucius such as, "Money has no value in comparison with noble ethics" revises people's value system.

As shown above, although modernization exceeds tradition in terms of material, we should no ignore the marvelous value of tradition due to its deep cultural accumulation. Thus, discarding either of them is a impolitic choice. Fortunately, the difference between modernization and tradition suggests that they can complement each other well given the fact that the main merit of tradition lies on the area of culture while the major benefit of modernization lies in the improvement of material.

笑会计UID: 2872606

我觉得你的思路有点偏离题目了，应该多从两者之间的关系论证他们是可以互溶的
While we are enjoying various benefits brought by modernization, the tradition culture appears to be useless to us. while用的很奇怪Some people might even say that tradition and modernization are incompatible since tradition is backward and serves to impede the process of modernization. However, some people content that we should not underestimate the value of tradition.你这some people的观点，并不是对立的，一个是“二者不容”，一个是“传统重要”，用however连接让人感觉很奇怪 In this light, is it necessary for us to only choose one of them? In my point of view, they can coexist and complement each other well.

Few people would not appreciate the convenience brought by modernization, that is, the advancement of sciences and technology. With the presence of aircraft and automobile, people do not have to stand with the boring  journey any longer. It is not uncommon to see that many people work in U.S and fly to Europe for vocations. Simply clicking on the buttons of cell phone, we can communicate with people all around the world. Moreover, by establishing international database, scholars and scientists can exchange their ideas and cooperate in a project.  Similarly, we university students learn many things from Internet website such as Wikipedia. We can post our ideas on the forms as well as appreciate other different opinions, all of which broaden our view sight and grant us a different perspective. All in all, modernization not only improve the quality of daily life but also rich our inner world.这一段跟主题关系不大，只是讲现代化的好处，虽说是引出了下一段，但看不出对论证有什么意义

For that matter, should we really need to abandon tradition? 你之前只是讲现代化的好处，现在直接将是否抛弃传统，给人一种你本身就认为二者是不相容的错觉It is true that modernization show its superiority over tradition in many aspects especially in the improvement of equipment and facilities; after all, few one would prefer a carriage over a car. However, traditional culture can still provide guidance for people today since the modern lives and traditional culture are essentially the same to some extend. Likewise, the moral standard remains the same over extended period. Traditional culture has been served to revise people's value system, and always will. These two aspects will be further analyzed as follows, respectively.

In fact, lots of people turn to tradition for guidance since many eminent traditional literature works epitomize the intent nature of the events which seldom change. One example aptly illustrates this point involved the Chinese novel---'' The Three Kingdoms''--a famous book recording the wars and complex relationships between three kingdoms in ancient China.  It's not surprising to see that many business or political leaders consider this novel as their favorite book. To hide your advantage so that your competitors may underestimate what you really get. To ally with other competitors to defend against the strongest one in order to survive. By learning these strategies, leaders as well as common people come to learn how to make a good plan when it comes to a intricate situation. That is to say, they learn how get a lion's share in the market and how to avoid mammoth losses when the loss is inevitable.哎，例子一直困扰我啊，总觉得举中国的例子很不爽但自己又找不出好例子

Moreover, tradition plays an important role in preventing people from deviating from their moral standard. For example, in China, materialism is the by-product of modernization. Immersing in the comfort and convenience of modernization, many people shift their cynosure from moral standard to money. They earn as much money as they can by all means regardless whether their behavior will bring undesirable consequence to the society. More and more people place more weight on money than moral. Wealth gradually becomes the only yardstick of the value of a person. Fortunately, the far-reaching influence of tradition alleviates this problem. The teachings of Confucius such as, "Money has no value in comparison with noble ethics" revises people's value system.

As shown above, although modernization exceeds tradition in terms of material, we should no ignore the marvelous value of tradition due to its deep cultural accumulation. Thus, discarding either of them is a impolitic choice. Fortunately, the difference between modernization and tradition suggests that they can complement each other well given the fact that the main merit of tradition lies on the area of culture while the major benefit of modernization lies in the improvement of material.这段确实不太明了，分两个论点应该会清楚一点
帮忙拍拍我的issue11，谢谢啊https://bbs.gter.net/thread-1136877-1-1.html

rabbieUID: 2871339

哈，正打算写这篇，占个座，写好来改lz的

crazyjooUID: 2805124

谢谢批注！我也注意到这个问题 没有注意他们是否cinompatible这个切入角度

我是这样的思路 现代化物质方面好>> 而传统的文化方面价值很大>> 最后就水到渠成地能compatible 关键是最后那一步由于时间关系或者构思的问题我放在结尾了，请指教一下怎么修改为好呢？

rabbieUID: 2871339

这个逻辑挺好的！
不过我觉得你在开头就把这个逻辑写清楚会比较好，这样看的时候人家心里也有个数，我看的时候也很confused。。。

crazyjooUID: 2805124

5# rabbie

问题是 现代的物质+传统的文化互补 很难表达好。。。（我纠结的就是怕人家认为现代文化要丢掉么？到底怎么表达比较妥当。。）

rabbieUID: 2871339

While we are enjoying various benefits brought by modernization, the tradition culture appears to be useless to us. Some people might even say that tradition and modernization are incompatible since tradition is backward and serves to impede the process of modernization. However, some people content that we should not underestimate the value of tradition. In this light, is it necessary for us to only choose one of them? In my point of view, they can coexist and complement each other well. （觉得别人的观点太多了，你自己的只有最后一句，而且对后文的提示作用不大，只是一个立场而已，可以加几句~把文章的思路在这里理一下）
Few people would not appreciate the convenience brought by modernization, that is, the advancement of sciences and technology. With the presence of aircraft and automobile, people do not have to stand with the boring  journey any longer. It is not uncommon to see that many people work in U.S and fly to Europe for vocations. Simply clicking on the buttons of cell phone, we can communicate with people all around the world. Moreover, by establishing international database, scholars and scientists can exchange their ideas and cooperate in a project.  Similarly, we university students learn many things from Internet website such as Wikipedia. We can post our ideas on the forms as well as appreciate other different opinions, all of which broaden our view sight and grant us a different perspective. All in all, modernization not only improve the quality of daily life but also rich our inner world.现代化好

For that matter, should we really need to abandon tradition? It is true that modernization show its superiority over tradition in many aspects especially in the improvement of equipment and facilities; after all, few one would prefer a carriage over a car. However, traditional culture can still provide guidance for people today since the modern lives and traditional culture are essentially the same to some extend. 我觉得这句话往前放放吧，让步太长了Likewise, the moral standard remains the same over extended period. Traditional culture has been served to revise people's value system, and always will. These two aspects will be further analyzed as follows, respectively.

In fact, lots of people turn to tradition for guidance since many eminent traditional literature works epitomize the intent nature of the events which seldom change. One example aptly illustrates this point involved the Chinese novel---'' The Three Kingdoms''--a famous book recording the wars and complex relationships between three kingdoms in ancient China.  It's not surprising to see that many business or political leaders consider this novel as their favorite book. To hide your advantage so that your competitors may underestimate what you really get. To ally with other competitors to defend against the strongest one in order to survive. By learning these strategies, leaders as well as common people come to learn how to make a good plan when it comes to a intricate situation. That is to say, they learn how get a lion's share in the market and how to avoid mammoth losses when the loss is inevitable.挺好的一段！

Moreover, tradition plays an important role in preventing people from deviating from their moral standard. For example, in China, materialism is the by-product of modernization. Immersing in the comfort and convenience of modernization, many people shift their cynosure from moral standard to money. They earn as much money as they can by all means regardless whether their behavior will bring undesirable consequence to the society. More and more people place more weight on money than moral. Wealth gradually becomes the only yardstick of the value of a person. Fortunately, the far-reaching influence of tradition alleviates this problem. The teachings of Confucius such as, "Money has no value in comparison with noble ethics" revises people's value system.

As shown above, although modernization exceeds tradition in terms of material, we should no ignore the marvelous value of tradition due to its deep cultural accumulation. Thus, discarding either of them is a impolitic choice. Fortunately, the difference between modernization and tradition suggests that they can complement each other well given the fact that the main merit of tradition lies on the area of culture while the major benefit of modernization lies in the improvement of material.
看完了，个人觉得如果加入一些两者是如何共存的会更好一点，把tradition的两段写在一起，加一段共存的。具体写一下是如何融合在一起的，会更切题一点~
第一次批文，而且菜鸟一个，哪里不好请指正~
我的那篇还在难产中。。。写好了请lz帮改好不？~
ps 觉得lz把传统放在了精神层面，这点挺好的！

rabbieUID: 2871339

6# crazyjoo
你也没写现代文化不好要丢啊，可以写：很大程度上，传统的文化blabla……
那难道传统的物质层面的东西就可以随便被现代化的替代了么？
两者的优势都不是绝对的呀

starfirezhuUID: 2842465

TOPIC: ISSUE147 - "Tradition and modernization are incompatible. One must choose between them."
WORDS: 672          TIME: 00:47:00

position: modernization and tradition can coexist. modernization do not
surpass tradition in all areas..
赞！这个position没走题！难得一见啊！
可是下面的写法~~~

1.modernization does show its superioty over tradition in many aspects, no
matter at material level or at spiritual level.
别一开头就讲自己的观点，先肯定对方的合理部分好不好？对方说的是 incompibable，你就不要说别的superior呀！而要说，确实有的时候是 incompatible的。扯别的去了叫人晕，不好！这个可以放在后面讲咯。

1.1   transportation (airplane / carriage)
       computer( release people from repetive grueling task)
       Internet(communication) wikipedia)
2.discard the tradition as a whole?     
2.1 traditional culture provide guidelines to us ( three kingdoms)
2.2 traditional moral standard shoule be treasured since the materalism
brought by modernization is deteriorating the bottom line of moral standard
to sum up: they can complement each other well due to their difference(这个difference其实是想表达 现代化带来物质的价值，传统带来的更多的是文化方面的价值，他们侧重不同。这个侧重不知道怎么表达哦是好，抑或是必须要再写一段讲他们的可相容性么？求教！）
[Conclusion]: Though incompatible in some particular aspects, they are compatible in most cases.

While we are enjoying various benefits brought by modernization, the tradition culture appears to be useless to us. Some people might even say that tradition and modernization are incompatible since tradition is backward and serves to impede the process of modernization. However, some people content that we should not underestimate the value of tradition. In this light, is it necessary for us to only choose one of them? In my point of view, they can coexist and complement each other well.

Few people would not appreciate the convenience brought by modernization, that is, the advancement of sciences and technology. With the presence of aircraft and automobile, people do not have to stand with the boring  journey any longer. It is not uncommon to see that many people work in U.S and fly to Europe for vocations. Simply clicking on the buttons of cell phone, we can communicate with people all around the world. Moreover, by establishing international database, scholars and scientists can exchange their ideas and cooperate in a project.  Similarly, we university students learn many things from Internet website such as Wikipedia. We can post our ideas on the forms as well as appreciate other different opinions, all of which broaden our view sight and grant us a different perspective. All in all, modernization not only improve the quality of daily life but also rich our inner world.

For that matter, should we really need to abandon tradition? It is true that modernization show its superiority over tradition in many aspects especially in the improvement of equipment and facilities; after all, few one would prefer a carriage over a car. However, traditional culture can still provide guidance for people today since the modern lives and traditional culture are essentially the same to some extend. Likewise, the moral standard remains the same over extended period. Traditional culture has been served to revise people's value system, and always will. These two aspects will be further analyzed as follows, respectively.

In fact, lots of people turn to tradition for guidance since many eminent traditional literature works epitomize the intent nature of the events which seldom change. One example aptly illustrates this point involved the Chinese novel---'' The Three Kingdoms''--a famous book recording the wars and complex relationships between three kingdoms in ancient China.  It's not surprising to see that many business or political leaders consider this novel as their favorite book. To hide your advantage so that your competitors may underestimate what you really get. To ally with other competitors to defend against the strongest one in order to survive. By learning these strategies, leaders as well as common people come to learn how to make a good plan when it comes to a intricate situation. That is to say, they learn how get a lion's share in the market and how to avoid mammoth losses when the loss is inevitable.

Moreover, tradition plays an important role in preventing people from deviating from their moral standard. For example, in China, materialism is the by-product of modernization. Immersing in the comfort and convenience of modernization, many people shift their cynosure from moral standard to money. They earn as much money as they can by all means regardless whether their behavior will bring undesirable consequence to the society. More and more people place more weight on money than moral. Wealth gradually becomes the only yardstick of the value of a person. Fortunately, the far-reaching influence of tradition alleviates this problem. The teachings of Confucius such as, "Money has no value in comparison with noble ethics" revises people's value system.

As shown above, although modernization exceeds tradition in terms of material, we should no ignore the marvelous value of tradition due to its deep cultural accumulation. Thus, discarding either of them is a impolitic choice. Fortunately, the difference between modernization and tradition suggests that they can complement each other well given the fact that the main merit of tradition lies on the area of culture while the major benefit of modernization lies in the improvement of material.

starfirezhuUID: 2842465

谢谢批注！我也注意到这个问题 没有注意他们是否cinompatible这个切入角度

我是这样的思路 现代化物质方面好>> 而传统的文化方面价值很大>> 最后就水到渠成地能compatible 关键是最后那一步由于时间关系或者构思的 ...
crazyjoo 发表于 2010-8-10 16:23

论证是否compatible不是说各自的优点就可以了，而是要说他们之间很多时候不可以被替代，可以共存，而且相得益彰！

rabbieUID: 2871339

lz帮改改咯~谢过~
https://bbs.gter.net/viewthread.php?tid=1136987&extra=