想知道这个能不能拿4分。。有提纲，求找茬~~有拍必回！ARGU174

mildwaterUID：2606507

TOPIC: ARGUMENT174 - The following recommendation was made by the president and administrative staff of Grove College, a private institution, to the college's governing committee.

"We recommend that Grove College preserve its century-old tradition of all-female education rather than admit men into its programs. It is true that a majority of faculty members voted in favor of coeducation, arguing that it would encourage more students to apply to Grove. But eighty percent of the students responding to a survey conducted by the student government wanted the school to remain all female, and over half of the alumni who answered a separate survey also opposed coeducation. Keeping the college all-female, therefore, will improve morale among students and convince alumni to keep supporting the college financially."

WORDS: 387(改后436)          TIME: 00:30:00         


提纲：
1、调查本身可信度不够
2、即便调查可信，提供的信息没有说明具体的问题，过于抽象
3、推出的结论没有依据：improve morale among students and convince alumni to keep supporting the college
4、也没有提供其他解决方案

In this argument, the president and administrative staff of Grove College recommend to the college's governing committee that Grove College should preserve its tradition of all-female education. To support this assertion, they cite evidence of two surveys conducted in students and alumni. However, I find their evidence is not supportive as it seems.

First of all, the argument fails to provide us sufficient information concerning the details of the two surveys, which undermines the credibility of them. Information such as the quantity of the samples, whether they are representative, whether they expressed their opinion at will instead of being forced, the time span between the two surveys and so forth, affects the accuracy and credence of a survey. For example, if the surveys only cover limited numbers of the students or alumni at Grove College, or if they hid their true opinions when took part in these surveys, or the two survey were conducted in different time, they could not support the arguers' opinion as strongly as they should be.

Secondly, the author overlooks the different and exact opinions between faculty members , students and alumni. The argument only mentions about the percentage of supporting or not, but fails to provide more details why these people choose like that, which undermines the effectiveness of the arguer's suggestion. That is to say, it gives no description about both the positive and side effects of the two ways of accepting students. If the school's administrator could not find the definite and true reasons of people's choices, it is unlikely for them to make any decision.

Besides, the assumption that keeping the college all-female will improve morale among students and convince alumni to keep supporting the college financially is unwarranted. No evidence such as these quotations of these people is provided in the argument, so that it could not convince me to believe that.

What' more, the arguer unreasonably leave out all the other methods to attract more students to Grove College except the admitting tradition. In fact, other factors, such as the location of a college, the quality of faculty, the rank among all colleges, the charge for fees and so on, will also be taken in to consideration when students choose their desirable schools. Only considering the admitting rule if far from sufficient.

To sum up, the argument is not as reasonable and well-rounded as it seems. If the author wants to make it more reliable and persuasive, he/she should provide more details about the two surveys, talk to some students, faculty and alumni personally to find out the hidden reasons for their choices and prepare other proper methods to attract more students for Grove College as well.
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自己感觉语言有些单调；展开不是很充分。
多多指教~~

mildwaterUID：2606507

木有人理……自己顶一下~
拍的童鞋留下自己链接 water会去回拍！！

mildwaterUID：2606507

哎 最近复习没有动力了 觉得再怎么复习也就是那样 考场一紧张 什么都会忘 举得例子还不是牛顿爱因斯坦。。。
怎么办。。

oldfishdkUID：2692510

同是菜鸟，与君互勉
分析一下这篇文章，它的结论是“we should stay in century-old traditionof all-female education rather than admit men into its programs”,它的论点有1: ”eighty percent of studentsresponding to a survey want to remain all female”, 2: “half of the alumni who answeredthe survey opposed coeducation”,并且举了目的 1: “to improvemorale, 2: “keep support from alumni”

提纲：
1、调查本身可信度不够
2、即便调查可信，提供的信息没有说明具体的问题，过于抽象
3、推出的结论没有依据：improve morale among students and convincealumni to keep supporting the college
4、也没有提供其他解决方案 [觉得这个似乎关联不大。]

[我觉得可以攻击,对于现在学生,和校友的调查未必能表明潜在入学人群的偏好]
[另说,老师的调查是不是也能攻击呢?就是指出,招收男生也未必会导致入学人数的增加]

In this argument, the president and administrative staff of Grove Collegerecommend to the college's governing committee that Grove College shouldpreserve its tradition of all-female education. To support this assertion, theycite evidence of two surveys conducted in [among the] students and alumni.However, I find their evidence is not supportive as it seems.

First of all, the argument fails to provide us sufficient informationconcerning the details of the two surveys, which undermines the credibility ofthem. Information such as the quantity of the samples, whether they arerepresentative, whether they expressed their opinion at will instead of beingforced, the time span between the two surveys and so forth, affects theaccuracy and credence of a survey. For example, if the surveys only coverlimited numbers of the students or alumni at Grove College, or if they hidtheir true opinions when took part in these surveys, or the two survey wereconducted in different time, they could not support the arguers' opinion asstrongly as they should be.

[觉得可以就这个作为主要的一点展开，因为文中提及students和alumni的人数都是在responding和answered当中的百分比，而并没有提及not responding和not answered的人群的意见，可以这么说“Under the extreme circumstances, there are far more current studentsand alumni who have not responded to this survey, which denotes that these twosurveys are not on the behalf of the majority of students and alumni.”]

Secondly, the author overlooks the different and exact opinions between facultymembers , students and alumni. The argument only mentions about the percentageof supporting or not, but fails to provide more details why these people chooselike that, which undermines the effectiveness of the arguer's suggestion. Thatis to say, it gives no description about both the positive and side effects ofthe two ways of accepting students. If the school's administrator could notfind the definite and true reasons of people's choices, it is unlikely for themto make any decision.

Besides, the assumption that keeping the college all-female will improve moraleamong students and convince alumni to keep supporting the college financiallyis unwarranted. No evidence such as these quotations of these people isprovided in the argument, so that it could not convince me to believe that.

[觉得这一段很单薄,因为我也不知道该怎么办，我摘录了北美范文的一段话“This aspect of Grove's admission policy is only oneof many factors that might affect alumni donations. For example, since Grove'sfaculty are generally in favor of changing the policy, perhaps the change wouldimprove faculty morale and therefore the quality of instruction, in mm having apositive impact on alumni donations. And, if the particular alumni who are in aposition to make the largest contributions recognize faculty morale as important,an increase in donations by these individuals might very well offset a declinein smaller donations by other alumni.”]

What' more, the arguer unreasonably leave out all the other methods toattract more students to Grove College except the admitting tradition. In fact,other factors, such as the location of a college, the quality of faculty, therank among all colleges, [and] the charge for fees and so on, will also betaken [into] consideration when students choose their desirable schools. Onlyconsidering the admitting rule if far from sufficient.

[觉得你最后一个的着力点不是很好..是不是可以把这段删掉然后重点展开前面的呢?]

To sum up, the argument is not as reasonable and well-rounded as it seems. Ifthe author wants to make it more reliable and persuasive, he/she should providemore details about the two surveys, talk to some students, faculty and alumnipersonally to find out the hidden reasons for their choices and prepare otherproper methods to attract more students for Grove College as well.

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语法错误看到的真不多，提了一下结构和想法上的意见，也可能是不对的

一些浅见，欢迎交流

mildwaterUID：2606507

4# oldfishdk


终于有人拍了，嚎啕大哭，感激涕零……

你的话启发了我。感觉文中的逻辑是这样的：
1、faculty建议收男生，理由是可以吸引更多学生；2、students and alumni的意见是收女生，作者认为听从students and alumni 的话可以to improvemorale and keep support from alumni.

如果作者想要反驳faculty的建议的话，应该驳掉的是：收男生不一定会吸引更多学生，而坚持收女生，能够有更多的好处，比如XX,YY.

这样的话，感觉作者反驳faculty没有反驳的到重点。因为他们在各说各的好，很难衡量。
如果作者要更好支持他观点，应该：
1、收男生不一定会吸引更多学生，可以向未来的学生调查，看他们的真正喜好；
2、保证现有的调查的可信度；
3、提供足够的证据说明收女生可以鼓舞士气和提高赞助。

（最后一个着力点，确实比较弱，没有就事论事，有点散和空了。有凑数嫌疑……我在展开方面一向比较薄弱，就是不知道怎么改进，你的话很精到！我以后还要多多加强。多谢指正！！！）

mildwaterUID：2606507

4# oldfishdk

另外，and so on 的用法，我刚才查了一下，前面貌似不用加and哦

例子：

Whether this will spell an end to negative and opportunistic politics remains to be seen but a more representative democracy could mean a better representation of the interests of all Australians in finding sorely needed directions on the big questions that confront us about our future, such as infrastructure, climate change, economic security, telecommunications, the tax base, a sustainable population and so on.


来自：
http://www.smh.com.au/national/letters/more-debate-on-the-big-questions-will-benefit-all-20100822-13aqq.html

oldfishdkUID：2692510

5# mildwater 其实我也很菜啦，哈哈哈

觉得你最后这个提纲很好的，应该完满了吧

但我就是想问一下，arg应该是攻击论点对吧，但它这里faculty的态度是作为论据给出的，我就不明白攻击这一点是不是很合适。

hyacinthUID：2184492

not fully developed indeed...

this one should be a 4...

mildwaterUID：2606507

7# oldfishdk

faculty 这个点不是作者的论据吧。对他的立场没有帮助啊。faculty这个应该是他要反驳的论点的论据吧……感觉写argu其实就是站在写这段话的人的立场上，帮他想想怎么样能更好地支撑他想要的论点，包括指出他的不足以及提出建议

jiafeng518518UID：2237458

提纲：
1、调查本身可信度不够 (how did you found that? which survey is not believable? please specify it )
2、即便调查可信，提供的信息没有说明具体的问题，过于抽象( 要expand， 你可以说文中没有具体说明参与调查的学生和alumni 分别各自有多少人。比如只有5个人参与了，有4个人回了也是80%, faculty 的论据也是有明显问题的，how could draw the conclusion that it will attract more student to apply?)
3、推出的结论没有依据：improve morale among students and convincealumni to keep supporting the college(这个的确是有问题的）
4、也没有提供其他解决方案 [觉得这个似乎关联不大）